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Craft Chat Chronicles
Craft Chat Chronicles
A Writer’s Journey: Finding Identity, Voice, and Story in the Creative Process
Welcome to the inaugural episode of "A Writer's Journey," where we peel back the curtain on the creative process with honesty, humor, and heart. Co-hosts JD Myall, Jay Marie, and Mo kick off this series by sharing their personal paths to becoming writers—from childhood escapes into imagination to formal education and professional milestones.
What begins as a simple introduction transforms into a rich exploration of the creative psyche. Jay Marie reveals how documenting microaggressions in college led her to discover screenwriting as her perfect medium. Mo describes writing as "a calling you can't get away from," explaining the peace it brings despite its solitary nature. JD recounts how being an outsider drew her to stories where she could see herself, even when those narratives didn't fully represent her identity.
The conversation dives deep into practical aspects of craft—the joy of world-building, the struggle of revision, the eternal debate between plotting and pantsing. You'll hear candid admissions about the spaces where creativity flourishes (Mo needs aesthetic tranquility while JD can write with the TV blaring) and the ethical considerations of transforming real-life experiences into fiction. When one host admits to turning an ex into a villain, it sparks a fascinating discussion about who "owns" a story.
Throughout runs a thread of revolutionary possibility—how writing in any genre, from fantasy to satire, can address our challenging times. The hosts share their literary heroes (Toni Morrison, Zora Neale Hurston, and Octavia Butler) while examining how these pioneers created space for diverse voices in literature.
Whether you're a seasoned writer or just beginning your journey, this conversation offers both practical wisdom and the comforting reminder that creative struggles are universal. Join our community, share your own writer's journey on social media, and remember the episode's powerful parting message: you have way more to offer than you think.
Link: A Writer's Journey with Scrivener!
#1 Novel & Book Writing Software For Writers
Welcome to Craft Chat Chronicles, the go-to podcast for tips on crafting best-selling fiction. Here at Craft Chat Chronicles, we bring you expert interviews, insights and tips on writing, publishing and marketing. Join the conversation and embark on a new chapter in your writing journey. For workshops, show notes and more information, visit jdmayalcom. That's jdmayalcom.
Speaker 2:This episode of CrowdChat Chronicles. We are about to go on a writer's journey.
Speaker 4:Enjoy, hey everybody, welcome to the first episode of A Writer's Journey. I'm one of your co-hosts, jay Marie, with my other co-hosts, jd, mayol and Mo, and what we'll be talking about is everything about writing, from craft, insecurities, publishing, more and everything in between. In this very first episode, we're going to talk more and everything in between. In this very first episode, we're going to talk about ourselves and just get into how we became writers and our journeys. So, jd, do you want to kick us off?
Speaker 2:I'm JD. I am a freelance writer. I've written for publications like Ms Magazine, HuffPost, Writer's Digest and some others. I'm a soon-to-be traditionally published author. My novel Heart Scam Bit will be out in 2026. I co-chair Drexel's MFA Alumni Association. I've been a sensitivity reader for Macmillan, I've been a judge in the Wrriters Digest annual writing competition and I'm a lover of craft. So, Jaymarie, tell us a little bit about yourself.
Speaker 4:I have um, so I've been interested in, I would say, reading um. When I was. I didn't really get into writing until I was older, but right now I have an MFA in creative writing, one in nonfiction based in memoir, and the other one is for screenwriting. So what about you, mo? Tell us a little bit about yourself, hey.
Speaker 3:I'm Mo. I've been writing all of my life and always loved it. I have an MA in English and I have an MFA in creative writing.
Speaker 2:Let's go back to the beginning.
Speaker 3:What first got you into writing Was it a childhood passion, or was there a book that inspired you, or was it something that you decided to pursue later in life? So for me, I'm the only child and so I had used my imagination, because that's all I had to play with and I was a big reader. My mom and my grandma were very big on education, so I had a book room, I had a toy room and that included lots of books and I was really drawn to reading and I was drawn to writing Fast forward. I always knew I wanted to write. That's very cliche, that's what all writers say, but it's the truth.
Speaker 3:Writing is a calling, I think, and I think that's why everyone has the same story, because it's just like oh, that's something that would be fun to do. Like, you are actually called, you can't get away from it. You actually called, you can't get away from it. You know it's, no matter how laborious and solitary it is, there's a feeling of joy and peace that you get from it. So that led me to eventually getting an MA in English. Then I was like no, I really, really want to write, and then that led me to get my MFA in creative writing from Drexel University.
Speaker 4:For me. I also started out as an avid reader. As a kid Loved reading, loved like daydreaming was my thing. I don't. I didn't really think of myself as being a writer. I thought it was something like other people did for me to enjoy, until I got older. Um, I was in college.
Speaker 4:I took a creative writing class and I started thinking, oh, this is something I might want to explore. Um, because I was having experiences at college that weren't so great that I didn't have. I guess I didn't have the tools to be able to explain, like, what was going on. And these days there are, there are terms for microaggressions and that sort of thing that people use, but I didn't know any of that at the time. So it started as like a people exploration for me in terms of, okay, this thing happened, and so I would write it down and like, oh, you know, she moved that way and said this, and it became this people study.
Speaker 4:That ended up becoming the way that I do my character studies. Um, because I wanted to understand, um, the underlying things of what wasn't said, but because they didn't say something, what did that mean? That becomes the subtext of story, and so I started to learn craft just on my own in terms of figuring out my own life, and that's my first novella was based on that when I did my first MFA program, my first MFA program of MFA in creative nonfiction, and so I wrote the novella for that, and then, as time went on, I realized that screenwriting was actually one of the perfect tools for me as a writer. I prefer screenwriting as a way of layering things and images in a particular way that I love with that, and that's what led me later on to then get an MFA focused on screenwriting.
Speaker 2:That's slowly, slowly finding my way into becoming a writer Love that I kind of shared some similarities with Mo in that I was raised an only child. My brother is significantly younger than me I was in a dorm when he was born and my sister is a half-sister, so we weren't raised in the same house you know we lived with. We shared the same father, we had different mothers, so we lived in separate houses. So writing and reading were my form of entertainment growing up. I always loved reading. I would devour a 300 page book in a day.
Speaker 2:I've been writing since I could hold a pen, but, like before I even started physically putting it on paper, I would, in my imagination, rewrite my favorite stories and make myself a character. Um, like I love the Outsiders. Growing up I read it 32 times. I memorized the first paragraph. I won't bore you by reciting it, but you know I just that was like I was deeply geeky and awkward and you know still am. You know a little, you know different, and writing and reading were like escapism to me. So I just thoroughly enjoyed it and enjoy it still, and I guess that's where it began for me.
Speaker 2:Fun fact though, I was in a class at Drexel and I was talking to them about how the Outsiders was my favorite book growing up and it was my mirror book. I saw myself in those characters because they were treated like outsiders and treated like they were different. And I was in a military area but they had us like in the middle of a very Jewish surrounding area. So it was like one little street of army kids and then the rest was like mostly wealthy, mostly Jewish, and I was treated differently a lot of times in that environment. So I identify completely with the outsiders because the way the greasers were treated was how I was feeling I was being treated and I mentioned it in class once and the teacher was like, isn't it interesting that the book you saw yourself in was also a book that excluded you? And then she pointed out the fact that there were no Black characters and I was like, wow, I need therapy. What's your favorite thing about writing and what part of the process excites you the most?
Speaker 4:jay murray I get really excited about the initial stages, stages like the coming up with the ideas and the characters and all of that. I'm really great at that. The rest of it can be a bit of a headache sometimes, but, like, I do love those initial stages of like, oh, who are these people? Where are they, what are they doing, what is this about?
Speaker 3:and like putting all that together, um, is the most exciting part for me the most exciting part for me is that's the stage once I know who the characters are and their purpose. So for me it goes back to like my first piece I'll never forget. We had to write a fable in the second or third grade. We had to write a fable and I wrote about this little girl named Marie who wanted to be a queen, but she didn't come from royalty and so there was a beehive in the back of her home and she thought that if she got stung three times by the bee that she would become a queen. And so she went to irritating and agitating the beehive and got stung three times and the only thing she got from it was a sore arm. And so the moral of the story was to be happy with who you are.
Speaker 3:Like. I felt like oh, once I got that down and once I knew what it was, I remember like I was bust out. I didn't go to my neighborhood school, I was bust out. And so like I'm excited all the way home and I couldn't wait and I got off the bus and I ran home and I just started with my story. So I'm always excited when I know the, the premise of the story and what it's where it should be heading and, man, when I can start writing it, that's when it comes to me. That's my favorite part. What grade was that again?
Speaker 4:about second or third. Wow, that's very deep for like second and third grade.
Speaker 3:I love that I went to elementary school, second and third and all of my friends loved it. Like my classmates used to say, they loved it and I was like, yes, A plus.
Speaker 2:I like world building. I mean, I guess you can tell that, since I do a lot of fantasy, I like creating characters that make people think and feel I love escapism. Again, I'm back to that I like escapism. That's why I think I like creating worlds, because I like to try to speak to the things in society, but not directly, you know what I mean Like echo some of the things that are happening, but in a way that's like fantasy and fun.
Speaker 3:It was really interesting. I was at a group yesterday with writers and you know we start. You know, of course, what's going on in the world now, you know. So we are three weeks as we're recording post-Trump election, and so you know we were talking about. You know just what do we do and how do we fit in.
Speaker 3:And it's interesting, there were those you know who said, look, I'm not a frontline revolutionary, I'm not a frontline revolutionary, like I'm not going to be out on the front line, but this is what I have to offer. And you know, I always say the act of buckling down in writing is an act of revolution. What we see now, that we actually have a part in very historical things happening and that we get to be recorders of what's going on, and sometimes that would be, for some that would be through nonfiction, for some that would be through fantasy, for some that would be through contemporary fiction, for some it would be through fantasy, for some that would be through contemporary fiction, for some it would be through graphic novels, like there's all different ways and spaces. For some they would be by creating, you know, documentaries, right. For some they could create comedy and sapphires, you know sitcoms. So there's always a space in you know addressing and everybody's space is different.
Speaker 2:Very true, very true. What is the hardest part of writing for you? We all have something that trips us up or that that we struggle with, whether it's like plotting or revising or just getting started. What's that thing for you, jay marie?
Speaker 4:how making it all fit together in a particular way. It's something that I'm still, uh, something I'm particularly working with craft right now. It's something I'm working on right now in terms of, um, okay, like, I have my characters and I have this plot, but first couple drafts it's not sinking, um, and so, like, right now I'm going back to was it what they call it the third rail, something you know about the, my protagonist. What is really propelling her through, right? Um, because my initial thoughts don't quite, don't quite fit, or I feel like, well, I think she's pulling it in a different direction, I'll put it that way. And so now for me it's just like, okay, what is it that she's deciding, instead of me trying to fit what I thought this initially was as to.
Speaker 4:Okay, well, let's follow. I need to follow this character um, this character um has her own needs and getting clearer on that, to uh, make it all sync. Hopefully that makes sense. So so, right now, something that I'm working on. That's the harder part for me right now, because this is a bigger. It's more of like a fantasy epic that I'm not always writing, that I'm excited about, but taking all those like fun elements and really connecting it to her deeper needs.
Speaker 2:Love that. How about for you, Mel? What's the hardest part?
Speaker 3:Well, you know, j Marie, that makes a whole lot of sense, especially because every character is distinct, right, so they have their own voice. They sound different, even in your mind. They sound different, even in your mind, like, um, they sound different. And we are a lot of times we throw as writers, we throw ourselves into these characters like it's not. So, it's not, like what would, what would I do? Well, this character is a 75 year old african-american woman. Um, I don't know right, you know we're not the same, but it's just natural to be like I would do. And so that part is separating the characters, giving them their own unique voice and their own story and their own space, is definitely always difficult.
Speaker 3:For me, anne Lamott talks about the shitty first draft. For me, anna Mack talks about the shitty first draft. And you know just, you know from my professional background where, you know, I'm used to documenting very succinctly, very, very tightly. And so, although I know that the first draft is just that, it's a draft, it is not the manuscript. You know it will change several times the manuscript, you know it will change several times I still spend too much time trying to get a tight, shitty first draft. And I say tight because in my mind I already know like, well, it doesn't matter, let's just get this out, but I still want it tight, I still want it as good as possible, just to change it around anyway. So I tend to spend too much time, um, on my, on my first dress, creating and, and they, they, they are tight, but it's a waste of time, it doesn't matter yeah, I am.
Speaker 2:I think I'm torn between revising being the hardest part for me, because I tend to revise till I'm sick of it and just getting started, because sometimes when I'm writing something I really really like, it's super hard for me to tear away for something else that I have to do Like there might be a deadline on something, so it's like I got to get this done, something else that I have to do, like there might be a deadline on something, so it's like I got to get this done, but I'm really loving that, so it's so hard for me to like tear my focus from what I'm really really loving. But the thing is, once I do that and once I move to the other thing, you know, and I actually get started on it, the passion comes and the love for it comes and I go back into the stuff I enjoy, like the creating worlds and all that fun stuff. And I go back into the stuff I enjoy, like the creating worlds and all that fun stuff. So once I get started, then I'm going to like it, but it's just sometimes getting there because I don't want to tear myself away from something else. That's a challenge.
Speaker 2:And revising because you start off loving. I love the creation process. You start off loving it and then, when it becomes like a job, when you're going back to fix it over and over and over again, you love it less. And then, by like round 30 of revision, you're like if this shit don't get off my desk, you love it a lot less by the end. But the goal is to try to make it as close to perfect as possible for the reader.
Speaker 3:But there's definitely a chore for me anyway have you ever have you guys like find it difficult, um, especially in revision, because you you've married something and now you have to break up with it like, oh man, I love this line, like this line is, so it was major and it fits right, but it's like it's on a. It's on a cutting block, not from an editor, but, like you realize well, as the story developed, it's not fitting in as cleanly as it did when you first did it. However, you love it like. I will try to fix this. I will try to put it somewhere. Like it takes me a long time to be like you know what it's been. Nice, I love you, but we gotta.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's hard I'll break up, especially having to do that with whole scenes. I'm just like I love this scene so much. Yeah, same thing trying to find a place for it, but it's just like you know it doesn't work anymore. You're wasting time.
Speaker 2:Find a folder for it because it might work in the next book. It might not fit this book in this scenario, but it might be like, ooh, that line I love would be great here. You know, that scene I had to cut from book one fits in book two, perfect.
Speaker 3:Well, you do. I mean, I do say it, but it's like, no, it was for this and like you know, that has to be done and you will. You know you will do it.
Speaker 3:But I'm talking about that process of literally breaking it, because it's a process like you literally going through like the grief of losing it, like the like, let's see if this could work, let's go to counseling, like, but it's your creation, so yeah, it's really emotional to have to break up with that scene or that line or that thing that was like, sometimes, what the story was even built upon like, and then all of a sudden it's like this doesn't fit anymore yeah, I know I've talked about this before, but for me it was when we were in MFA program and Sadiqa gave me a brilliant change to my first chapter.
Speaker 2:But then it would recall reworking the whole beginning of the book you know what I mean and it was brilliant. So at first I was like I don't want to do that because I don't want that much work. But then the more I thought about it, I was like, damn, she's right. But it was like you don't want to cut what you already liked. But then, ultimately, I had to take the scissors to it because it made it better and stronger. But yeah, I've definitely been in that not wanting to do it, but it needs to be done. Phase yeah.
Speaker 4:I found, um, especially with beginnings, especially like after you get a first draft done or a second draft, the beginning is usually something you have to end up tweaking anyway by the time you get to the end and everything happens or whatever, and it's just like, oh, you have to go back almost always and tweak some things and fix things around to make it work. So I find going back to the beginning is something I always end up having to do anyway.
Speaker 2:I like to go back to the beginning too, because I like to go back to tweak some foreshadowing in like really subtle stuff that you wouldn't pick up on. But in my mind I'm laughing because I know that this is very much either an echo of the end or a hint about the end, and you have no clue because you're just starting the story. So you know, I like that. Are you a plotter, a pantser or somewhere in between? Do you do detailed outlines or do you just dive in and see where the story takes?
Speaker 3:you depends on the day like I haven't narrowed that down about me yet, because sometimes it's just like I can, I can, I, I can, I'm both, I'm both. Sometimes I start out plotting, sometimes I pants it and then plot. So it just really depends on how the story comes to me, what inspires the story, how I feel when I'm writing. So I tend to, if I get an idea while I'm working on a piece, I'll start plotting. But I usually, when I sit down, I sit down based on some sort of thought, some sort of sentence, some sort of phrase, and then I'll kind of get that out. And then I'll go back and figure out kind of what that story is and start kind of very vaguely outlining, not very extensive but very like, just vaguely outlining. But if I am writing something and I get another separate idea for it, that's when my outlines tend to be a little bit more detailed and that's when I start plotting more. But I think I usually start off pantsing.
Speaker 4:For me, I go back to my. I mostly do screenwriting these days, so part of my training it's mostly what you would call plotting, I guess. So like I plot out my main plot points and then, before I even sit down to start writing the screens in like the screenplay format, I have an outline of the scenes and I'm working off the outline and it's within the scenes, the dialogue and the action and all of that. I don't know, I guess that's I'm still plotting, but then when I go to write the scene I'm coming up with it as I go along. So I guess it's a mixture of both. But I know the scene objective, because to me otherwise that's just wasting time.
Speaker 4:No, for anybody that uh does the painting. But yeah, I, when I sit down I have my outline. So I, I know, for for the most part, like what the scene objectives are, and then as I'm creating, as I'm writing the scenes, that's where I go back to, I guess, freedom, that freedom of when it comes to dialogue and movement, but mostly, yeah, plotting. I guess I'd be considered a plotter.
Speaker 2:When I first started writing, I was definitely a pantser. I just would sit down and just go, but then the problem with that would be the stories would ramble, and I later learned that people who pants do a lot more revision to make it make sense. Basically, and you know, now I'm somewhere in the middle because I have to have an outline. So I stay focused and I stay moving in a direction, but as I'm outlining, sometimes the character and the story will lead me down different avenues than I originally started.
Speaker 2:It's not going to be completely different, like if I, for example this is a wild example that I'm just going to throw out there but like, let's say, I had planned on them being an astronaut and landing on the planet Venus. They won't then become a scientist and be in a classroom in Connecticut. You know what I mean. So it's not that drastic of pantsing. You know they might make it to Mars instead or they might make it to Venus, but something horrible or something different in the outcome comes. But so it's not a huge deviation from my original plot, but there is some deviation and flexibility and sometimes I'll like stop and amend my plot along the way because of, like, my ideas change like Ooh, what if this or what if that? You know what I mean and I might like slightly amend it, but it's usually not like a whole 360 turn yeah.
Speaker 4:I'll do that too, Like if the characters are going in a particular way and I'm like, oh, this idea makes much more sense or this is way better than you know, I'll allow myself to make those changes. I don't necessarily am so married to that.
Speaker 2:The original outline, yeah so, um, when you're outlining and stuff, where are you usually at? Are you at home writer? Are you out and about writer? What's your routine look like usually?
Speaker 4:I'm at home, I can't be around other people and like noise and all this stuff. Um, when I'm doing my like focus, focus writing, when I'm like what I call like development phase and just like observing people in life, yeah, okay, yes, I'll go outside for those things. But if I'm working on something specific, I have to be at home in my office, quiet or music or something. Yeah, I can't be around other people.
Speaker 3:I, I'm very structured like that too. I need a space that's kind of set up, that is aesthetically pleasing for me, a space that is calming, quiet, certain, smells good. I need this whole kind of calming thing going on, and so that's usually in my inside of my home. Sometimes with revisions and things like that, sometimes with revisions and things like that, I can go sit in the park. Coffee shops do not work for me. I'm too nosy. I am like I was out with my mom last week and we went to breakfast and you know there's a little tight end corner and it was. It was a father and son having a conversation about you know, I guess kind of ironing out some things, and so I'm talking to my mom, but then all of a sudden, like this whole, when the father says, you know, I would like to talk to you, you know, if you're uncomfortable, it's cool I perked up like, oh, this is about to be good, right, and so like I'm so nosy Not only that, there was something that he mentioned about.
Speaker 3:You know, he was the African-American young man here he was 30, because I ended up minding people's business and they let me mind their business and he said something about you know they're talking about something that was going on in high school and how you know he, you know, wasn't doing really well in high school, but he was able to get to college and dah, dah, dah, dah. So at some point I kind of was interested in that story and it's like you know, I hear you say that. You know you said that. The first thing I say it's like you know, I'm sorry I'm going to address the elephant in the room. I'm in your business and then I was proceeded to have a conversation on and I explained to him that I was a new teacher and then I worked in an urban school and you know, I hear you say that your grades weren't good but that you ended up in college. You know how did you do? You know what was the struggles for you?
Speaker 3:So that's why I can't, because, even if it was just like me writing down a dialogue at some point, I want to involved, I'm involved, I'm thinking I started to have questions in my mind about other people's business. So I need to like, know, like, stay out the way. Um, so the coffee shop thing doesn't work for me, but like, and even during revisions there's still too much, you know sensory things going on for me to be able to focus. But I can go. I got my MA from Arcadia and I don't live too far so I get to go and sit under the tree there. I do that a lot and do my revisions. That works fine, but it has to be quiet and aesthetically pleasing be quiet and aesthetically pleasing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I am. The good part of my add is that, um, chaos around me doesn't oh, doesn't usually distract me because my mind bounces everywhere anyway. So, like I can be at home, writing with the tv on can't be a great show if it's a great show to distract me and I watch it. So I have a playlist of shows that I don't find that interesting or distracting, but I'm aware of them. You know what I mean. But they're not good enough to make me look away from what I'm doing.
Speaker 2:I can write. I've written in McDonald's, I've written in Starbucks. I wrote in the library all the time. That's part of what led me to work in there, because I just would be there writing for hours. I got to know them all. Then I was like, oh, they're hiring, well, I might as well get paid to sit here, sit here anyway. So I can pretty much write anywhere I am, I can.
Speaker 2:I'm only distracted, like I said, if it's something really interesting, like if me and you, mo, would have been in that same restaurant hearing the same conversation, I would have been able to write through that. Now, if it would have been a couple breaking up or going through some marital issues. I might have been like, looked away from the keyboard and got distracted then. But that little conversation, you know, wouldn't have piqued my interest as much, so I don't know you know wouldn't have piqued my interest as much, so I don't know I guess every now and then I would have been sitting there taking jotting down notes of what they said and like what their situation was, as like story ideas or something like that.
Speaker 3:I was sitting there eating, I'm like, and then he was talking about this, and then the father was like, well, if I came to every track meet in in high school, why wouldn't I come in college? And then the son was like, well, I sent you the the roster. He was like, well, I never got it and and and like things like that. And I'm thinking like, wow, like how much miscommunication plays a great part in things like that's an easy thing. But then what happens when ego gets involved, like I do think, on those other, what happens when ego gets involved?
Speaker 3:And this could have been cleared up with, like yo, son, I, you know what's going on with your uh, you know you're not going to tell me, you know when, when your track meets are. And he was like, oh, I sent it to you. Like, oh, I never got it, like you know, but they're having this conversation. He's done graduated and he's a productive citizen in the world. But it was great that they were able to have that conversation and reconcile. But yeah, like I do take notes on stuff and you know it will show up somewhere, but I can't Listen. I be involved. Like I had questions, like can I ask you a question?
Speaker 2:Oh, that made me think about a story that was floating around a couple of years ago, the bad writer friend story. I'll refresh people who might be listening. And then there was a group of writers who had a friend group, basically, and one of them donated a kidney to someone and basically documented the whole experience of them. Donated a kidney to someone and basically documented the whole experience of her donating this kidney and she wrote a letter to the person who received the kidney, to the, you know, I mean to the family of the person that received the kidney, and stuff like that, if I'm remembering correctly. So it was like a well-documented thing. And then one of the people in her group was inspired by that and wrote a story about it.
Speaker 2:But in the story this woman was like narcissistic and self-serving and basically she was speaking to that person on, you know, basically giving the kidney and then documenting for your friends the whole step-by-step of your kidney giving process and stuff like that, and the story became like a word winning and was doing really great.
Speaker 2:And then the girl who was the one who actually gave the kidney was offended and ticked and was basically feeling like she sold my life and um, so she started calling all these award things and, um, the woman who wrote the story was a woman of color and the other woman wasn't, if I remember correctly. So she was calling all these different award ceremony, basically complaining, and it ended up in a lawsuit that the girl had posted and she changed it in later drafts but that ended up coming to bite her in the butt. You know, as far as inspiration, you know what I mean versus documentation, and so it was a whole big thing in the writer communities of bad writer friend and this, that and the third. So when you were talking about, oh, that would be inspiration, it made me me wonder what would be the line for you, like if you were the kidney-giving person in spring. What would be the line for you in that scenario? Where does inspiration?
Speaker 3:Honestly, I honestly don't remember the details.
Speaker 3:Some of them sound new to me what you're saying. I remember the conversation around it and I would definitely have to go back. We should definitely come back around to this, because that would be really good. What I remember about it is the conversation was who has the right to tell a story? I remember that being the big conversation around it. It's in the Times, so I have that. I can go back and read it. The interesting thing is so I don't know, I don't know, mr A and MrB, right, I just overheard a conversation and that's.
Speaker 3:Writers get inspiration and stories from that all the time. Um, I wanted to write about an experience that one of my friends had. I would check in with them. I would check in with them. I'd be like, listen, I want to. This would be a great fictional story and based around this, the events of what happened, and I want to write this story. I want to write a story about it, like, how would you feel about that?
Speaker 3:Especially something like you know something as as personal as you know donating the kidney or getting the kidney transplant. I would let them see the story first and have input. I would include them in it. I would ask them first how they would feel, because the one thing about it is, I would ask them first how they would feel. Because the one thing about it is, you know, it's just like I jokingly one time said that I was going to write like a story about the ex of mine and I like just say his name was was I'm just making up a name, let's just say his name was Eric.
Speaker 3:I was like, well, I just say Derek, right, jokingly, but this is the thing I can say Derek all day long. But if Eric reads the story and he knows this is what happened to Rekha, he's going to know I'm talking about him, right. So even with certain things, like in there it was like, oh, she would have known, or she should have known, that her friends were going to know, that that's her story, that's her friend's story, um, so I don't think that there's anything wrong with drawing inspiration from a friend, right, but I think you should check in, I think you should how they would feel about it. And even if they was like I'm not comfortable. But you can always brainstorm like, but this is a really, really great Like, how can we get this story out, like you know, in a different kind of way, like you know and they can help you even come up with something else that's still based on, as they say in movies, based on a true story, but not necessarily the true story.
Speaker 4:Exactly, I agree going about it that way, but in this situation it doesn't tell me they weren't actually friends, so it was like more of a passive, huge, passive-aggressive way to deal with this person really.
Speaker 3:Okay, I can read this again. I remember reading it because it was a big thing, but I don't. I'm going to read it today.
Speaker 2:Alexa Dunn has a whole video breakdown of it, and one of the things that was interesting too is like when it ended up being a whole court thing or whatever is that? Like the group messages were subpoenaed and ended up later being revealed and her friends really weren't her friends. All of her friends were like co-signing on this and bashing her in this scenario and a lot of them were just like if I remember correctly, a lot of them were just like wow, this is really disgusting that you know the way you're like step-by-step documenting this or whatever. You know what I mean. Like, if I remember correctly, it was a lot of shady so-called friends, an interesting scenario. But I think y'all are right checking with the person.
Speaker 2:I've never had a situation where something a friend has done has been something, so, you know, intriguing, where I'd be like, oh, I should write a story about that, especially because I write teen like fantasy and stuff like that. So, like none of y'all have done, like you know, burned down houses or anything crazy I could use for climax. You know I have had um, an ex, who pissed me off and hurt me to the point where I made him a villain in the book. None of the rest of the story was like him, but I definitely made him the villain in the story and he knew I mean he sure had told him that and he was actually surprisingly cool with it.
Speaker 3:So I, I think so. I write contemporary, you know, short story collections, fiction, uh, fiction dealing with, like, the intricacies and ordinariness of humans. So everything has happened in my world, has happened to everybody before. You know what I mean Family trauma. You know trying to figure out where your spaces in this world. You know why. You know how we get comfortable and don't move so technically, me, you, my friends, my neighbors are all in my stories, right? Because like it's nothing. I remember I used to be like oh, this idea is so cliche, oh, this is so cliche, oh, that is so cliche, oh, oh, oh oh. But it was the bottom line is life is cliche, right cliche. And so that was like, okay, well, that narrative doesn't doesn't apply to me because the the life in the world that I write about is cliche.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we don't know anybody in the bad writer friends thing, so we don't really know enough to judge who was the bad writer friend. But it was just an interesting story. It was an intriguing story.
Speaker 3:You are writing. Somehow, you know, especially if you grow up around a lot of people, a big family, you have friends like you are getting some sort of inspiration from something that happened to them at some point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, take Taylor Swift, all her songs about breakups and stuff like that. I'd be flattered if I was the guy in that, because if my breakup turned into a bop I'd be flattered. I'd be like, oh cool, I'm in a song. I mean unless she was saying really horrible things about me.
Speaker 4:I was going to say what if you were like why are you doing one?
Speaker 3:This is the thing, and.
Speaker 3:I had said this before Kat Williams, but Kat Williams said it. You know I had said this before Kat Williams, but Kat Williams said it. You know much more eloquently, but eloquently. But this is whatever you, when you become a part of my story, I get to tell it. So if you don't want to be the villain in my story, don't do dumb stuff, Like. Don't be the villain, Just like. Vice versa, Like once I'm involved in your life, you know I am a character in your life. I am now a character and jay marie's and jd's life, and that you know.
Speaker 3:If I am the villain, then that's on me, but I can't dictate to you what the right and what not the right about your, your life and your story and the characters in it. So try to be a good character. It's just like in law they always say you know, when typing emails, especially anything in writing, just remember that it could be an exhibit. So you know, watch what you write, because it could be an exhibit. And the same thing with dealing with people Like you could be a character in writing. You are definitely in there with character and their proverbial story, but you could be a character in writing. So just be careful how you interact and how you treat each other.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I can admit. There are people in my past who treated me terribly, who are villains in my story.
Speaker 2:Great part of being a writer. You can kill your villains fictionally and nobody's hurt, but you get your frustration out, Bring them back from the death and kill them again if you want to.
Speaker 3:And if you don't like the conversation if you know, I like to have hard conversations. If they're like, well, you're talking to me, you'd be like why would you think that? Do you think I was talking about you? Like, do you think that's about you? Or you know, do, depending on what kind of person they are, I'd be like Paula, dumb on dumb. Everything's not about you.
Speaker 2:Now what I would do too, though, is in those scenarios, I would fictionalize enough of the character so that there's not a direct like like with that girl where she took direct pieces of the letter. That's a direct through line, so everybody directly can see that that's where it came from. So, to try to avoid a lawsuit, I mean, I would fictionalize. I might take that person, but then some of the elements would be fantasy, or it might be elements of, like, three different things, or, or individuals or whatever, blended to make this one character. That way, nobody's pointing at me, but I mean other people don't? Ariana Grande directly referenced Pete Davidson, and then he did a stand up coming back to it. That was really funny. I remember how she talked about how he was supposed to be well-endowed, and in his stand-up routine he basically said she was an evil genius. He said she's tiny. Everything looks big to somebody that small, and then he said so now she gave me a lifetime L, because any woman I sleep with it will be disappointed.
Speaker 4:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:Like hey, you know, I was like hey, put it out there.
Speaker 4:So the moral is don't write creative nonfiction when you need it to be high fantasy.
Speaker 3:Exactly and we joke about it. But realistically, this is something that writers think about, because even when we're writing, we are pulling from our family dynamics, we are pulling from our own experiences. We are pulling from our own experiences. We are pulling from the people who surround us. We are concerned about what they will think and how they will see it or if we're talking about them. But I know several authors have said you know, we spend a lot of time worrying about that and a lot of time they don't even think it's them. That's true. They be like well, I never figured out. I've never. I forgot the author who said it. But she went. She had said that. You know that same person came to her and was like that person is terrible, who is it? It's like you know.
Speaker 2:It's like you know. That's why I went with a pen name, Because I wanted to be able to write freely without thinking about my family's judgment or what they will think about these books or the characters or whatever. But that didn't work because Facebook outed me. Facebook people you may know showed me to my grandpa and my grandpa was excited, so he goes into the family group and shares it. My granddaughter's a writer now.
Speaker 3:It's like you know and no one ever you know. You know, I think back to then we still don't know who Zayn is, but she kind of was at a time when she could get away with it. She kind of came out now. Now it might be a little easier to find her. She started writing again, but I think we're so accustomed to the erotica now that it wouldn't even be a big deal. But when she first started writing erotica and a Black woman and about, you know, black sexual experiences for women and you know it was a whole big thing. But you can't hide. Now it's just like this y'all Yep yep, yep.
Speaker 2:So when you write, how often do you write? Are you a daily writer? Are you a revised or right when inspiration strikes type of a writer I try to do a, a routine, um.
Speaker 3:Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. So, you know, I um haven't quite figured it out, but I make sure that I do something daily, um, whether it's revising, whether it's just, you know, um, writing, you know, uh, outlining an idea, um, but I I'm not all over the place. But I don't have a specific routine because if I say, oh, I want to write two pages a day, when I sit to write, when I can, because I have to find out that time I blink. It's like I understand people who don't test well, who when they get in front of the paper, they can't remember anything. I'm only like that when it comes to like it's time to write, so I, instead of standing at space and trying to force it, I'll do something writing related that moves it along. So I get something in daily. But I, you know, if we're talking about sitting down actually typing out something, I know it varies upon. You know how my brain functions that day.
Speaker 4:I'm similar. I can't say that I do writing like typing at the computer daily, because a lot of what I do is like pen and paper, like pen and paper. So for me, if I'm like something I'm sitting on the couch and like TV's on in the background and I'm just jotting down ideas or yeah, or like a scene has come to mind and I'm writing that down just like in notes so I can type it up later, that counts as writing for me. Any type of any type of thing that's moving it forward, even if it's just the sitting and imagining and like taking notes off of that, for me I'm like okay, that's it.
Speaker 4:Check on the day, because sometimes I can't just sit at the computer every day and just like type on the same, like I go blank or I'm just like I'm not feeling it right now, even though that's the couple hours that I have blocked off. I've gotten to the point and I don't know if I should suggest this. But like sitting down to watch something, I count as research. So you know, sometimes I have those days where you know I'm a screenwriter, so watching things sometimes, or reading a script or something, that's still, I count that as a writing day time.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to do something productive every day, whether it's like editing an episode or reaching out for somebody trying to schedule an interview, or writing. I try to write every day or revise every day. When I have those moments where I'm blocked and I can't think of shit to write, I try to go back to revising what I've already written, or I try to do it every day. Sometimes life intervenes, like I was telling you guys. Yesterday I took my daughter to a hockey game and I visited my parents and before I knew it, the day had flashed by and no writing got done. Hopefully today I'm more on task, but I try to do it every day. I don't always because life life's, but sometimes I, you know, I try.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you still got to live life. This is true. That's the main event.
Speaker 3:Until the day when you can actually do writing full time, that's just the way.
Speaker 3:That is when you can literally schedule your whole entire day around writing. You're going to have to account for the spaces that come, the time that's set out. You think that okay, I got this time, but again you don't know where you are going to be mentally and just physically. You could be mentally exhausted by the time that seven o'clock space comes around when you write and you need to decompress and so now that's eating into your time. But I also I always looked at reading as part of my writing process too. But like watching shows watching my shows that I enjoy I also look at that as part of the writing process that I enjoy. I also look at that as part of the writing process, you know, because ideas are generated, you know, inspirations are taken or just it just sort of kind of puts me in an imaginative spirit, right, you know just kind of living in that world and what's going on with them, and you know, and getting deeply involved is very stimulating for me. Have you guys watched Paradise? It's new, it's on Hulu.
Speaker 4:I haven't seen that one yet If you do check it out.
Speaker 3:The premise of it is very interesting. I'm not going to get a show away, but it's. I can tell you this part is sort of I'm not going to give it away but watch it and for me, just that whole concept of what Paradise is and how it's. You know, the story is kind of outlining how it came to be, but just the concept of what Paradise is is astounding for me and like sent me on this whole, like, hmm, definitely some great ideas out of it what's your go to?
Speaker 2:writing fuel like snacks when you have a long writing session. What's next for you?
Speaker 4:for me, it depends on the time of day. If I'm doing it, like usually on the weekend, I do my writing in the morning, so I usually have a cup of tea. Um, and I usually eat breakfast afterwards, so I usually have a cup of tea. If it's an evening session, um, I usually just have water and something crunchy. I like to when I'm sitting staring at the wall crunching on something, I don't know why, like carrots or pretzels or something. It's weird, but it helps with making presents.
Speaker 3:Nothing, because I tend to do it afterwards. So if I do it in the morning, I get up, I have my morning ritual, a prayer and um, some meditation setting my intentions, and then I'll have my coffee and then I write, um and if, and so I've, I'm sorry, I my breakfast, which was with my coffee, and then I write. And if I write in the evening, still I eat first, because that's just like the time, so like I don't, I usually don't have anything with it or waiting because I've just I've eaten, and if I can get in, when I'm in that space, like even if I don't eat, I'm not even hungry it'll be hours later, like once I'm in that zone and I start we just, we just rock, we just rocking out until I'm literally like so exhausted I can't open my eyes anymore or move my fingers. I've caught myself, you know, and I thought this kind of just happened, you know, when you're in school and you kind of waited around and you got to get this paper done, like you don't have any more options and I could like be exhausted and still, like you know, type through.
Speaker 3:But I found that like when just that's just my space, when I get, when I'm in, and I'm in, I don't want to stop. I have to literally be exhausted and I could go. And I'm in, I don't want to stop. I have to literally be exhausted and I could go. I used to actually think that my best time was the morning, but really I am literally. My best space is 11 to 5. I can literally write from 11 to 5. And if I didn't have to get up in the morning, that would be how I live.
Speaker 2:I would say my go-to writing snacks are like oatmeal, cream pies. Sometimes it's breakfast, because if I'm writing in the morning before work then I'll have like my little Jimmy Dean egg white scramble and I'll microwave that and eat that. I like frappes. I have a chai frappe sometimes or the little Starbucks iced coffees you buy. Those are my go-to writing snacks. If you could have any author over for dinner, living or dead, who would it be and why?
Speaker 3:Tony, they tied Tony and Zora Tony. Well, I got. They tied Tony and Zora Zora because that story is really interesting. Right, you know, zora was actually an anthropologist who was sort of sent because, you know the folks, the white folks didn't want to go in rural. You know the folks, the white folks didn't want to go in rural, you know Florida, but they wanted to know how the Blacks were back there living and she kind of went back there with them and you know, and told their story and her life as a writer, you know, is just her life period as a Black woman during that time is extremely interesting.
Speaker 3:And, toni, because Toni Morrison is just like her, you know she was for me, I find her books entertaining, but also she was just so profound, you know, um, and she just would be somebody who would you, you could just her insights into the world, you know, her insights into life, her, um, her insights into like one. What would I like to, what I also always liked about Tony is that, you know she made it clear like her story wasn't like the, the typical, um, you know I was, you know, poor, black and hungry story, um, so I definitely would love to talk to her about growing up in a community where there were black lawyers and black doctors and black everything. You know teachers, and that you know this, this black community, that that was integrated in class.
Speaker 4:So, tony and Zora- Not to steal, but Tony has always been mine One, because her house looked amazing and I'd want to sit on the porch with her by the I don't know if it was like the river or something it's always like the kind of house that I wanted. So, like I want to go to her house and like have a meal. I have so many questions for her. Her books were books that I read but had a really hard time with, just in terms of like the language and that sort of thing. And I like I just have questions about like writing writing in that way Because, again, I had a hard time with it. Her books I always needed a dictionary to read and I'm just like, why, why are we using these words? And, just like her, I want to talk to her about her experience in academia. Just so many different things. So, like she's someone that's in particular, I just have a lot of I would really want to have a long conversation with just for so many different reasons.
Speaker 3:You can't rush through. A Toni Morrison novel, like novels, you know you kind of get this space where you know you kind of, you know they're leisurely, right, you can read, you just read for entertainment, they're easy. But like you can't rush through, if you you can't read her in the night, you know you can't oh book club is due tomorrow, let me hurry up and read it.
Speaker 3:It's a wrap and that's what my book club used to get mad about, because sometimes you have life habits and you're like I can read this in the night and it's like you're going to get through the first chapter in the night with her.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and I feel like I love the way her mind worked and I wanted to know how it worked, and so I don't want to have dinner with her and talk about it, yeah, and she left you asking questions.
Speaker 3:You always had questions. I haven't seen a writer yet that throughout the book that she literally makes you stop and got to think about what she just said Exactly. Sometimes it's like, oh, let me look up the word, but sometimes it's just so profound you got to contemplate what you just read.
Speaker 2:How about you? Fun fact, my vampire book that I'm working on, the main character's last name is Morrison because of her, and her first name is Zora, for Zora oh, that's fun one, but, um, the person I picked would be octavia butler, because that was a very like. Kindred to me was a very impactful book. I write sci-fi and fantasy but, like prior to that, I hadn't really experienced that from our perspective. So it just opened my eyes for me that we can write fantasy, that we can build worlds and stuff like that, because a lot of times when you're a kid and you're Black, the Black books that you're given are like the pain narratives and the oppression narratives. So for me that was like, wow, you know, we can build worlds, we can time travel, we can do all this fun stuff. And that really impacted me as a young reader and even today as a writer.
Speaker 2:And I have a lot of questions for her about like Kindred and like what would Dana think about the world we're living in now and the Trump administration if she had traveled to this time instead of traveling back to the days of slavery? And then also like her book Parable of the Sower a lot of people think it predicted, like the LA fires, and they think that she's done some predicting, and I would love to see what she thinks about today and the policies and some of the civil rights that we fought for being repealed today. I would love to see what her writing would say to this time we're in right now. Yeah, I'm wearing right now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so all right. One final thing Any closing words you want to leave anybody with Any inspiration advice?
Speaker 4:I don't know if I'm in a place to give somebody advice.
Speaker 3:I had to keep it simple Keep writing, keep writing, keep writing.
Speaker 4:Well, for me personally, you have way more to offer than you think. You do Love that.
Speaker 2:Love that, love that. So I hope you've enjoyed meeting my friends and hearing us babble about writing. We enjoyed sharing our writer's journey with you and we hope you'll continue on. And you know, message us on social media, tell us about your writer's journey and where you're at. Keep writing.
Speaker 5:That wraps up today's Craft Chat Chronicles with jd mayor. Thanks for joining us. If you liked the episode, please comment, subscribe and share for show notes writing workshops.