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Craft Chat Chronicles
Craft Chat Chronicles
Season 2 Episode 5: From Photographer to YA Novelist: Rebecca Dazenbaker's Journey to Publication
Ever wondered how to seamlessly transition from corporate life to becoming a successful author? Join us on Craft Chat Chronicles as we sit down with debut author Rebecca Dazenbaker, who shares her incredible journey from professional photographer to YA novelist. You'll discover her unique social media strategies for platforms like Instagram and TikTok, and pick up practical tips for using tools like CapCut, Unsplash, and Pexels. Rebecca also opens up about the importance of balancing engaging content creation with everyday life, all while managing her creative process and mental well-being during the COVID-19 pandemic.
Explore the often tumultuous road to publication with Rebecca as she recounts her experiences with querying, rejections, and the invaluable support of critique partners and writing groups. We shed light on the crucial role an agent plays in refining both the manuscript and the query letter, and the perseverance needed to secure representation. Rebecca's story is a testament to the dedication required to transform a passion into a publishable work, and the extensive revisions that shape a marketable book.
Get a behind-the-scenes look at the thrill of negotiating a book deal and the collaborative efforts with an editor to bring a story to life. Rebecca shares her excitement about her upcoming book release, planned community-centric book launch, and future social media strategies. We also discuss the significance of critique partners in the writing process, honest feedback, and evolving writing approaches. Don't miss out—subscribe, share, and connect with us at JDMeyercom for show notes, tips, and more.
https://www.literatureandlatte.com/scrivener-affiliate.html?fpr=craftchat
Welcome to Craft Chat Chronicles, the go-to podcast for tips on crafting best-selling fiction. Here at Craft Chat Chronicles, we bring you expert interviews, insights and tips on writing, publishing and marketing. Join the conversation and embark on a new chapter in your writing journey. For workshops, show notes and more information, visit jdmayalcom. That's jdmayalcom.
J.D. Myall:In season two, episode five of Craft Chat Chronicles, we dive into Part 1 of our two-part episode with debut author Rebecca Dazenbaker. Again in Season 2, episode 5 of Craft Chat Chronicles, we dive into the first part in a two-part episode with debut author Rebecca Dazenbaker. Rebecca talks writing, craft, her publishing journey and a universe of stories. So listen and let's dive in and start chatting. It's nice to meet you. It's nice to meet you too. You're a whiz at social media.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Well.
J.D. Myall:I was looking at your Instagram. I was quite impressed.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Thank you. People say that, but I feel like, uh, I'm like I don't. I don't understand the whole Instagram thing. I find it really hard to make traction there. But I'm just trying, like. I'm like I'm just going to make, I'm like going to make an effort and then eventually it'll pan out. But I enjoy making the goofy TikTok videos. Um, I just find, like I usually am like right now you can't tell, but I'm wearing pajama bottoms, so I'm usually like in my pajamas all day. So I'm like, oh, I got to make effort to like get dressed on days that I create TikToks and stuff. So it's like is today going to be one of those days? If not, like maybe I'll just do another aesthetic video and let that go, it's fine.
J.D. Myall:What um? Is there any software or anything that you use to help with that?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Just CapCut. Um, that kind of helps, though, you know, sometimes I can get away with using the tick tock editor and I'm not. I think you can do a lot with the Instagram editor too. I just haven't created videos on that yet, so maybe someday I'll give that one a try too. But yeah, I went through, like Unsplash and Pexels, to just gather a bunch of like videos and photos that like fit my aesthetic like the red, white, black theme for my book and I'm like all right, I'm just saving all those. And then it's really easy to find templates on a CapCut and you just literally click the photo and it slides it in to match up with the music and it's like okay, great. And then I'll add the caption and post it. Those are easy.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Those take like 15, 20 minutes to create, whereas if I'm like talking, I'm like then I have to go through and edit out all the ums and the likes and the like. I'll just keep recording and then I'll start over saying what I said, cause I messed it up and, as you can tell, I'm a bit of a rambler too. So I'll have to go through and like I didn't need to say those two minutes of nothing Like, I'll just be talking for, like, I'll just be saying nonsense and I'm like, wait, I, it's just like my writing, in fact I'll just write, and then later I'm like take all that out, that that didn't need to be there. Why did I write that? So? But you just have to get it on page, you know.
J.D. Myall:Very true, very true. You can't edit a blank page, exactly. So tell me a little bit about your writing journey, exactly.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So tell me a little bit about your writing journey. So I'm a professional photographer. I saw that you do photography too, so I noticed that your pictures are really great, by the way, thank you so much so as you are.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:As I was looking through, I was like, oh, she's a photographer and so I was clicking on all your photos and so I run my own business. I've been since 2013,. I've been a full-time photographer. So during COVID I had to shut down my business. But right when I was starting my photography business, I had an idea for a YA novel.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So for those like 10 years up until COVID, I had been like jotting down notes just about the world building. And when our governor I live in Virginia our governor shut down all non-essential businesses, I just was going stir crazy. My kids were both teenagers, so they didn't need me to do anything. They were self-sufficient, making their own lunches and stuff. And so all this time that I'd spent every day running my business, I now just had free for and I didn't know for how long. So I was like well, I always said I'd write this novel if I had the time. So I took like a workshop on creative live through with Lisa Kron, wired for story, and it's like a three-day workshop and it like had like hands-on activities and so I had my world, but I didn't know what story I wanted to tell. So that's basically what I went through with her and then I just started writing and I was writing I didn't, I was literally just doing it for myself, for fun. And after I had written a couple of chapters, my husband's like maybe you should like start to actually like write this, like in paragraph form. So cause I was like sending him and my best friend like every chapter, like hey, look, I'm doing this, it's fun, and I was really writing just to curb the panic attacks, um, from the pandemic and I am not a person that would typically have panic attacks, but that was really terrifying, like everyone knows, and so you know I would get like the heart palpitations and just like the nerves and everything and just sudden anxiety onset. And so just escaping into this world really helped my mental health and I just had fun with it. I was writing for myself, I was writing just to have fun and I was writing the story that I would like to read.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I read a ton of YA, I read a ton of romance, so there's a lot of romance tropes, there's a lot of YA themes in my stories, and when I finished writing it and maybe had read it through once, I contacted a friend of mine who was traditionally published and I used to work with her and I had a corporate job before photography and I was like, hey, can you just tell me about the business? I didn't know anything about the publishing business or how she got a book deal, and so she walked through her publishing journey with me and she introduced me to her agent, which was, in hindsight, something that is very rare, like people don't usually just introduce you to their agent. Her agent requested the full, which was very sweet, but within a few days she was like I don't rep YA, but this is great, you should keep sending it out. And I had like people in my book club who'd read it and they loved it. So I was like, yay, I'm going to start querying and expecting it to be like so fast, cause I just loved my book and everyone had loved it so much.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:And this one agent was like it's great, keep sending it out. And so I was like yay, and then, like rejection after rejection started coming in and that was just like my my like heart did not handle that well. It was devastating for me. So, between this was like 2020, still end of 2020, like September to December, I maybe racked up like 60 rejections, no partial requests or anything. I wasn't getting any traction and I just told my husband I was like I can't do this, I don't want to do this anymore. And he was like, well, just, he's like, you can take a break, just don't give up. So I took like a one month hiatus over the holidays and then I started joining like actual writing groups, pitch groups, found legitimate critique partners, other authors, and figured out what I was doing wrong and there was a lot, and so I made all this?
J.D. Myall:Was it your query or was it your page? It was everything.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:The query letter wasn't right. It was so long, it was like 500 words and it basically was a synopsis and it wasn't even in the character's voice. So, yeah, it was really dry. And then I had a prologue, which was written from an eight-year-old's point of view, which you don't do for YA, and so it was just. There were so many things, the writing wasn't tight, there were a lot of flashback chapters that didn't need to be there, so, yeah, so it was a lot of just cleaning it up and making it more exciting and stuff.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Um, so I started re-queering in like April of 2021 and by the end of May I had an agent. So that part went fast. It seems like it went fast, but it wasn't. It was a lot of like revise, revise, revise, keep getting more critiques, more critiques, like over those like four or five months of revisions and then like six months more revisions, because it was intended to originally be a two book series or duology, and my agent was like take everything you want to do in the sequel and put it in the first book, but don't increase your word count. So that took like another three months to do that huge revision. And then she was like, okay, that's great, but you basically have one book and then a second book stuck at the end, so now you have to incorporate it all together. It's like, okay, I see what you're saying, I just don't want to do the hard work, but I did it. So now it's all like seamlessly integrated, and even more so now that I've gone through editorial developments, like this one character who wasn't going to be in this, who wasn't going to be introduced until the second book, is now in the second chapter. So I've just kept moving him in more and more as the revisions have gone on. Um, so now it's pretty seamless, but that's kind of in a nutshell.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I was on and this is something Michelle Wolfson with Wolfson literary Um, it's a very small boutique agency, but she one of her biggest. She's like several bestselling authors, but Kirsten White is kind of what drew me to her because she's a really prolific YA and now adult writer. And Lauren Blakely she represents a lot of romance too. So I was like, oh, ya and romance like that's me too. So it just ended up being perfect. She was a really great fit. So I feel very lucky and she's super patient and she's also very responsive, like if I send her an email. I'll hear back, usually within 30 minutes. So that's nice. You're not just sitting there twiddling your thumbs. So she's great. Mine was the opposite.
J.D. Myall:Oh yeah, mine was. It's me forever for her to put me on stuff because we had doing revisions. But then when I went on stuff it sold quick, but oh good we were doing revisions for I didn't think I was ever going to sub.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:We were doing so many. Oh, that's gotta have been like over a year of revisions.
J.D. Myall:Wow, well, you know, after a while you start to think well, maybe she just doesn't like it and she doesn't want to be. You know she's being, you don't want to tell me.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:But I mean, in hindsight it's like, okay, well, she knew what she was doing, because then it sold right away. And my, my agent is not an editorial agent. So like her comments were, literally take the second book and put it in the first book, like that was all of the like comments. So I was like, okay, but but I have these wonderful critique partners that I can like rely on now. Um, so that's great. And then I think now, going through the editorial process a little bit I'm I've only gone through first round so far I feel like that's going to greatly improve my writing. Just to see what those comments were, I was like, oh, it just kind of like opens up a world of I don't know the right word for it, but it just like opened my eyes to, kind of, where my writing was falling flat. You know, like seeing someone point out things in that way, I'm like, oh, okay, that makes sense. And so, and also like so far all of my revisions have been like dial it back, dial it back, try to get the word count down. You know, smaller, smaller, smaller, make it tighter. And now the editor is like we need to add in more of internal dialogue and a little bit of the choreography of the scene, and so we know like we can visualize what people are doing in the scene and all that stuff I'd been like taking out just to make it lean. So now it's kind of fun like adding a lot of, a lot of that back in Cause I love to hear what people are thinking and visualize what they're doing too. So it's all good.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Yeah, your story, the concept sounds really cool, thank you. Yeah, so I had that idea. Yeah, so I had this idea. Like I was driving past the cemetery and I was like, oh gosh, I wonder if my former self was buried there. And maybe it wasn't even a girl with curly hair it's all straightened out right now but like, maybe it was a boy or maybe I was a totally like born in a different nation, and like, well, how cool would it be to find out. Like maybe we just don't have the technology yet and maybe someday we'll have that technology to literally connect our souls from life to life.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I just brought, like my photography expertise. I was like what if we could photograph souls and then they could compare them like we do with fingerprints, right, like you have a little specific identifier, and then you carry that from life to life and, like you know, your DNA is determined by your parents, so your soul can really be born into anybody, right Like. So that's kind of like how the thought came about. And then, like I said, I've just been world building from then on. I was like, well, how would that change the world? How would that change religion? How would that change our nationalism? How would that change currency? You know?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I, the more I thought about it, the more I was like people will start judging you, not on these superficial things that we see through our DNA right now, but probably more of our actions, especially our soul's actions. And you can get penalized or you can get certain advantages based off of who you were in your past. So people come out of their soul identification. They're either going to have their inheritance from their past life Instead of passing it to your kids, you'll give it to your next life and job offers, because you were a famous mathematician and you have the Nobel Prize, so you're going to get all of these job offers or scholarships, um, and you know, waiting for you when you come out, or, if you were a criminal and you didn't finish your life sentence. You have to go in and finish that. Um, you know because so yeah, so. So there's that drama of it all.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:And then I in this world, part of my magic system even though it's not a fantasy like it kind of reads like a fantasy to me anyway Um, my magic system is that only a very small portion of the population has soulmates. So they can, they can scientifically identify them because they have almost identical soul, like Prince, they're light rays or whatever that are being photographed are almost identical. And then only a very small portion of people have soulmates. So it's kind of this like thing where you're going in and you're like, am I going to have a soulmate? And you know that most people won't. And so my main characters, like twin best friends, went in and they got, they hit the lottery, they got everything, they got the huge inheritance, they got the scholarship job offer, they got soulmates. So then she goes in and they're like you're going to get it too. And, of course, like everything goes the opposite, because that's what we do to our characters.
J.D. Myall:Yeah, love it, love it, love it.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Yeah, when is this slated to come out? Right now it's slated for July 1st of 2025. So, um do you have a cover yet no, I've seen a rough draft and I love my cover artists and I'm sure you'll be able to. Once it prints like you'll, you'll know who it is. But he's amazing. He's done Chloe Gong's covers. He did Jennifer Lynn's, barnes the Inheritance Game covers. So when they told me who it was, I couldn't sleep that night. I was so excited. I was like are you?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:kidding me. So, yes, so I'm really excited. Hopefully I'll have the success that those books have had, cause I'm like, oh my gosh, that would. That's why I couldn't sleep. I was like what? Like I didn't get a huge advance. So I'm like, if they're going to invest that much in that cover artist, like maybe that means good things, maybe I'll actually get some press for my book. But if not, like literally just so thrilled to have gotten this far, like my idea, my, my like constant mantra was it will happen, don't give up.
J.D. Myall:Like you didn't get a small advance either, though you did good.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Yeah, it wasn't. It wasn't like six figures by any means, but it's. You know it's split over two books. I would say it's like average. It's not small, it's not. I would say it's an average for a big five, right? Exactly For YA. Yeah, I'm grateful.
J.D. Myall:Tell me about your agent call and then we'll talk about the author call.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Okay, so she had surprised me. I mean, I got the full request when I queried her. She was my first and only full request from a query letter. I did have some from live pitching, but yes, so I've gotten one and only one full request from a query letter and it was her, and it was with 30 minutes of sending it. And so later that day I sent the full cause. I had to stop crying first. And so later that day I sent the full cause. I had to stop crying first.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:And then, um 10 days later, she called me on the blue and it was an unidentified number. I thought it was spam at first, but something about the New York, new York area code had me picking up and she was like hi, rebecca, this is Michelle Wolfson. And I like started, I was like like I kind of knew it was happening, but I didn't. And she, you know, kind of talked to me about my book and I love it so much and I've already read it twice and my daughter loves the idea because she had talked about it with her preteen daughter at the time. Now she's a teenager and her daughter was like you're going to sign her right. So she's like, so I felt obligated to call.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So she loves, apparently, to surprise authors with the offer call. And then she scheduled a follow-up call so I could ask all of my questions. So she was like did you, yeah? Yeah, so we had a follow-up call. I asked him my questions, I asked to talk with one of her other authors on her list and she arranged that for us and she won me over too. I fell in love with that author right off the bat, so that was great. What?
J.D. Myall:kind of questions did you ask your agent before you accepted the?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:offer. So it was like three years ago, so it's hard to say. I could probably pull up the document, um it. It was a lot of the standard stuff, cause I, I did all the research. You know, like I went to Google, I went to all my writer groups like, who do I ask? What should I ask? And I think, like the one that most people were, that recommended was to ask to talk with another author that she represents, asked to talk with another author that she represents, and there were things like, you know, will you um pitch like to the big five? Um, and she, you know she said yes, uh, you know, I, I I wanted print versus EPUB, um, cause I know there's a lot of like agents out there that mostly do EPUB now and I really want to, just I want to hold it in my hands.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I was like oh, I want to like. So there are certain things that I wanted and I was fine with her not being an editorial agent again, because I found, like, such wonderful critique partners so that we were just like a nice little tight knit group now. So, yeah, so I think it was all the standard stuff, it wasn't anything out of the norm. I'm just really glad that I did connect with one of her authors. She published last 2018, then she kind of stopped writing for a while, but Michelle like never dropped her. She was like stay with me, you know, like. And then once her, once this author's sons were off to college, she started writing again. So they sort of like rekindled their professional relationship, but they'd stayed friends the whole time.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I love that idea of like, if this book doesn't sell and that was one of the questions that I asked Michelle like, if this book doesn't sell, like what happens then? And my fear was she'd be like, well, maybe I'm not the right person for you, but she was like oh well, then we'll just go on to the next one. You know, keep writing. And I did like, once I went on submission, I started, I kept writing. So I have a couple of other books waiting for homes now and I'm and we haven't pitched what my second book is now. So I'm like halfway through writing a third that we think might be the one, because it's another speculative like this one. The other two are contemporary YA, so we'll see. So yeah, that's how it went. Sorry, I am a rambler, so just shut me up if I talk too long. So how?
J.D. Myall:did the editor call though?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Okay, so that was also unique. Four days before the offer came, my agent emailed me that one of the editors was enjoying it and that's all she said, and we'd had authors enjoy it before and nothing happened Again. It had been like a 20 month thing. So I literally thought nothing of it. I was like, whatever, I had sent Michelle my newest manuscript over that weekend and so she called me on Monday or Tuesday and I thought she was calling to like she had read it. She reads fast, obviously. So I thought she was calling to like she had read it. She reads fast, obviously. So I thought she was calling to read it.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So, as I do, I rambled for the first like 20 minutes of our conversation. We talked about her son going off to college and his dorm mates and our Google calendars and just everything busy we were up to and vacations and stuff like that. And then the conversation kind of lulled and she was like so we got an offer on your book today and I was like what you were like, why didn't you lead with that? And it's funny because I'm friends with another author she represents who got her first book deal like two weeks after me, so both of us got our debut book deals like back to back. And she said she went back to Michelle when I told her that story and Michelle was like I don't remember it like that. And I was like no, it was 20 minutes. I have the call on and his office is I'm pointing that way but his office is over there. And so I'm like on the phone and I like walk over there and the glass you know, he has like these pained glass doors to the office. They're closed. And I'm like I got a book deal and like meanwhile, it's like Michelle's telling me about the deal and I'm trying to like write down the details and I'm like telling him and he's like what? And I'm like I got a book deal. And he was like calm down, I was like okay, and so anyway, like I was just pacing the house and everything, and she told me the details and like what do you think? And I was like it's, it's amazing, just take it or negotiate, like you've done this forever, whatever. So she was like, yeah, she's like I think we can get better. Um, I was like but she's like you, you want to? I was like, absolutely yes, I will sign it right now, just whatever. So, anyway, she was, she was wonderful, um.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I did not get, I didn't talk with or email with my editor until after the terms were agreed to Um. So I didn't have a call with her until I got my developmental letter, and that was the first time we'd actually talked. So we'd emailed a couple of times but I um Michelle, didn't know what changes she wanted to make. We, it wasn't discussed. So that was something that my agent said to me once my development editor came at it.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Sorry, my edit letter came in. She was like they bought this as is, without requesting changes, so you don't have to do anything. But I was like, no, no, no, I love her ideas. I'm going to give it a try. I have literally never met an edit that I didn't love or fall in love with.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:The same held true with this revision. I'm completely obsessed. And so now I'm like really nervous about what my second letter is going to say, cause I'm like, oh, I hope I don't have to change that much more, cause I so love the plot now, like this story is the same. The story has always been the same, even as I've incorporated all these changes, um, but the plot has made significant changes here and I'm just like, wow, how did I write this? Like it's just so, like it just blows my mind. I'm like how does my brain work like that? I don't know. Like if anyone asked me to tell them the story without sitting and writing it, like it just would never have come out. But I don't know, I'm just still like in awe. I'm like I don't know, it's great, it's a fun feeling your, your editor story.
J.D. Myall:um was like other people I've talked to. There was another girl who told me that she didn't talk to her editor until like after the deal. Mine was the opposite. I talked to her first.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Wow, yeah, I think that's pretty common. And you kind of like because you want to get an idea of the working relationship, you know, like am I going to want to work with this person? But it was like I could tell from the first email exchange because she wrote like words in all caps and there was like 12 exclamation points at the end of things and I was like, oh, okay, we have the same energy. Like I could just tell from her and like with Michelle, I like have to like go and take exclamation points out of my emails after I draft them, like calm down. But with Nicole she's like oh, the exclamation points. I'm like, yes, let's do it, we'll take it out of my novel but we'll keep them in the emails.
J.D. Myall:So yeah, that's exciting. What are your plans as far as launching goes?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I have a friend Well, it's like more of like my husband's business colleague's wife who opened a bookstore nearby, an indie bookstore which I'm in love with.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So I already know I'm going to partner with them for my book launch. But it's a very small store and I have a lot. You know we live in a really large community here and I have a lot of friends, so there's no way everyone's going to fit. So we'll probably like rent out a space in my neighborhood there's like a community center, right and just have the, the bookstore, bring copies there. I don't know, um, so that's like one thing. And then I'm hoping, um, to go back to my hometown I live, I grew up like three hours South and maybe do like a signing there. And, um, I have friends who live in Portland, oregon, and so they're like you have to come out here and do one at oh shoot, what's the big bookstore there? My brain's gone to Powell's. So they're like you have to do, you have to do a signing at Powell's.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I was like I don't know if Powell's will take a debut author, but maybe I'll just be like hey, um, so, yeah, like I've already talked with my kids are both in high school, so I already talked with their school librarian to like I'd love to come in, like talk to the writing classes. You know that sort of stuff. Um, I don't know, like I'm sure it'll build more and more as time goes on. So the librarians they were like, oh, we asked this one author to come in and they quoted us $20,000. I was like, oh well, I will not charge you $20,000. Yeah, but now I'm thinking big thoughts like can I charge $20,000 at some point to go talk to a school? Does he actually get that much money? Cause that's a lot. They were like I think that he just didn't want to do it, and he was like, well, it'll be more than my while for $20,000.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I was like, yeah, most things would be, I think. So that's wild. Anyway, I don't. Yeah, no, I'll probably be like, just let me come in and talk about my book. What?
J.D. Myall:are your social media plans?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I know you um, since you're the social media, yeah, so, um, I mean pretty much for every phase I try, I'm trying to like, pump things up. I did just get character art a few days ago and so I have a plan to roll that out, but there's a lot.
J.D. Myall:Did you make it or did the publisher do it?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:No, neither I hired someone on Fiverr. I did a lot of research because I love digital art, but I didn't want someone who would use AI. So I did a lot of research and I found someone whose catalog or portfolio went back pre-generative AI, back to the 2016s, and I was like okay, so he's legit and I love it. There's just a lot going on right now, so things are slowed down. I just need to kind of get through the next couple of weeks personally with things that are going on. There's a funeral, there's stuff going on. So I was like well, that's going to take a back burner and then, once I have the energy to focus on that, like I'll go on. But the nice thing is we have like 14. I know you have closer to like 16, 17 months to your launch, so I have time right and I don't also like keep slamming the same content down my followers post, so I want to make sure I have something new and different to say each time.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Um, so that was like my last one. I was like oh, I haven't talked about retitling my book. So the last one I made was here are the titles that I sent and here's the one they selected. Um, so I was like that's something fun I can do and I don't have to be on camera. Um, so that was something new and different. But you can only do so many like book trailers till I was like, uh, that's, you know, it's just not getting much traction. Now, one thing that I've noticed my Tik TOK views are lame, my IG views are lame, but YouTube, like same content posted on YouTube, does great.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So, I use Metricool, um, which is a free social media planner, um, to repost my content. So I'll just download it from Tik TOK and then I'll repost it to Facebook, ig, uh, pinterest and YouTube and um, the nice thing like about YouTube and like again, like YouTube. Just for some reason the book trailers do well there and then on Pinterest. The nice thing about Pinterest is the content only like, the reach only grows, and I've noticed that with my own photography work. Like photos that I posted four years ago get more views than content I'm posting now. So things like snowball with Pinterest and you just have to give it time and it marinates and it just gets better and better and better. So the best time to post on Pinterest was two years ago and then it'll just keep going. So that's a little like, uh, maybe a little unknown thing that people don't know and that I just learned through photography. Like I, most of the hits from my photography site are from Google and Pinterest. Like, so I like love it, cause it just gives you a little bit of that validation. Um, yeah, so you can always repurpose stuff. So, if it, if it bombs on Tik TOK, which everything's been doing lately because, um, it's more about the Tik TOK store these days than like sending stuff to like.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I don't have a Tik TOK store yet Cause I'm obviously not selling books or anything. I'm hoping to get some fun swag. Um, like, there's the crossroads symbol, like the circle with the X in it is a big symbol in my book, so I'm hoping to get like some temporary tattoos or stickers and, um, I'm actually probably going to get my very first, only ever, tattoo. But when I launched my book, or, leading up to my book, launch um of the crossroads symbol, just to like memorialize my very first novel. Um, so I, anyway, so I there's like a fun, a bunch of fun stuff. So maybe at some point I'll have a tiktok store and my content will start doing better, but for the most part now it's just like. Oh, it's like I just try not to worry about it. I'm'm like 300 people is 300, you know 300 people who didn't see it yesterday. You know like I didn't reach yesterday.
J.D. Myall:And the book's not out yet. Once the book is out and in stores and you have readers, it's going to grow. The numbers are going up.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Yeah, and I think you know I feel like Simon Teen who will be doing like all of my publicity and stuff. They're really great, like I've been following them for a while now and they are really great about promoting even backlist books. So yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited to be a part of their team. I think it'd be great. We'll see. I don't have anything to compare it to but again, like anything I get I was, I would be great. Which is why, when I saw your post, I was like, oh, that's one thing I can do Come this way for an event.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:maybe we can do an event together or something oh, I would so much better to partner up with somebody, because I hate just like blabbering on and I think it's so much easier to do it conversational style and like talk with one another, you know, um they were both YA fantasy. Yeah, I was saying, we're both YA yes, tell me about your book, because I looked up your um blurb and I couldn't like on the discord, like you haven't put the description, you haven't announced yet that's why you couldn't find it.
J.D. Myall:I know, so tell me about it. It's called hearts gambit, it's with wednesday books, which is a division of mmillan Nice, and it's pitched as like Outlander meets the Night Circus. So it's these magical warring time, traveling families, and there's like a forbidden love. Oh my God.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Okay, forbidden love is my very favorite trope. I love the angst of it. Like, love it. It's like any romance tro trip, like any romance book forbidden love. I'm like, yes, put me in there. So it just made sense that was what I wrote too, so we have that in common. So mine's a forbidden romance also.
J.D. Myall:Yeah.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Yay, oh, my gosh, yeah. So let's plan on that. We will do an event together.
J.D. Myall:I absolutely love that, definitely, definitely. I can't wait, me too. Tell me about your creative process. What's your writing process? Look like.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Uh, so I do plot, um, but then I usually abandoned my plot, at least like halfway in Um. Usually it ends where I expect it to end, but then the middle route goes elsewhere. Um, as my brain just continues to work on it and like, as I'm writing, I'll be like this is boring, what can I do? That's something better, you know. So I might.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:The first book that I wrote this one I was kind of editing as I went and I would go back and read the chapter a few times before going up to the next one. I've stopped doing that and it's like the future me gets really annoyed at my past me, because then I'll go back and read my rough draft and I'm like, why does it suck? Because it's written so badly. But I'm literally just trying to get all the dialogue on the page. And so now, like right now, because I drafted half of the new book, then I stopped for developmental edits, drafted half of the new book, then I stopped for developmental edits, and now I'm going back and I'm trying to like reread what I wrote, just to remember the story that I've written so far. It's like, oh how, like, how did I get a book deal? It's so bad.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So it's just very rough and I'm going through and I'm trying to fix things and I'm also just trying to press forward so I can finish actually writing it, trying to fix things and I'm also just trying to press forward so I can finish actually writing it. So I try to just push through and keep writing without going back to read, and then once I get to the end I'll go back and actually I'll wait, like they say, I'll let it marinate for a few weeks, and then I'll go back and start reading and I try to read it twice through, read and revise twice through, and then I'll send it to critique partners and I'll be like I know this sucks, but I just need to make sure the story works before I really start polishing it up and sending it through. All of the pro-writing read, like you know, like things like taking out all of the sticky sentences, and I try to do as much of that as I can, but then I'll find like repetitive words and stuff that your eyes just don't catch as much. Um, so that's kind of like.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So where did you find?
J.D. Myall:your critique group, your critique partners.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Um, I found the original group through um moms who write I think it is something like that on Twitter. I used to be on Twitter a lot. I haven't used it in like a year, but they would have like the monthly, like Q and a, and they were like, if you're looking for a critique partner, write your. This was again like way back in 2021. You know what's your book about and you know whatever. And so I found a couple there and they were wonderful.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:One of them is no longer writing. She runs a farm up in New York and just running a business and running a farm and having four children Like she's taken a step back. And then the other one we still are cheerleaders for one another, but our writing styles are so very different. I think we've just kind of like gone separate ways.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So somehow I'm trying to remember through, I think through one of my pitch groups, I found this other author who is my favorite and also my least favorite critique partner, cause she's so like it's like a dagger to the heart, like she does not hold, like she doesn't pull any punches. She will state very clearly that's something like I don't like this. No, why would he say that? Like she. She doesn't try to make it nice, but she's always dead on. So she like, even though it hurts to read her comments, she says what has to be said and so I appreciate that.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:It's funny, cause my best friend and her will be reading at the same time and my best friends will be like I love this, or maybe you should reword this, and she'll have to turn off my critique partner's comments, cause they make her angry, cause she's she's so mean. I'm like I know, but she's so right, like that's the thing, like I can't let her go because she always says what I need to. You know, like oh yeah, she's right. And you know there's a couple of things I'll be like no, I keep that. But most of the time I'm like, oh yeah, I gotta change that um, when that happens.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I know, so it's. You know, it's like one of those things where your heart's palpitating, palpitating as like the comments are coming through, because I use google docs, so like I'll get the email that she's made comments, and I'm like shoring myself up, like okay, I'm gonna read them. But uh, she, yeah, so she's wonderful. And then I have another one, um, the one that my agent represents us both, and she also writes YA and she's going to be a 2025 debut, so she's in the same group with us. Her name is Veronica Bain, uh, which I always reminds me of Cassandra Clare. Did you read the? Wasn't there a Bane character? Anyway, so, anyway, so, yes, so we're critique partners now too, which is great. It's nice to have someone that I can tell my agent like Veronica's read it. She liked it, so now you'll like it, but it's good.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:My agent was sending me to her intern, like not sending me, but she would send my pages to her intern to read first, and my intern started to give me, like kind of a small little edit letter, and then my agent would read it too. But she would be like here's Molly's letter, you know, cause she doesn't do the critiques. And then now her intern is an agent, so she has her own clients to work with. So now I have a new critique writer. It all works out, so, yeah, I love it. Do you have some, too, that you like?
J.D. Myall:Yeah, I got a couple I met through Drexel, so I got a couple that are newer. And then I have some like from forever, like Maggie Guile, she. I got a couple that are newer and then I have some like from forever. Like Maggie Guile, she's a Canadian writer. Yeah, me and her met in an online critique group years ago and we wrote a novel together. Oh wow, that's great. We were both very raw and young in our writing journey.
J.D. Myall:So it wasn't very good. But now that we're both further along and she's had some books out and I got a book coming out and stuff we want to revisit the idea.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:I was going to say come back to it. Yeah, that would be so fun. Oh my gosh, that's great. Yeah, I have a few others that I just remembered. I was like oh yeah, because I like to like. You don't want to always hit up the same person Right and be like can you read this one?
J.D. Myall:Can you read this? You ever need a critique, um, you know, hit me up, yeah or if you want to send a copy when you get the book. You know, yeah, comment on it or blurb it or share it or something like that. I don't know what my blurb would mean, because I'm just like you, brand new. I know, I know it's not matter, but you know the offers there for both of us. People will be like shady blurred my book.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:Yeah, absolutely might not matter today, but you know it will, More than willing to you know, I know, oh my gosh, I just like had like a flash forward of like us and our pictures at like our book launch event that we did together, and then, years later, like we'll meet up at a convention and be like this was us five years ago. Look at us now.
J.D. Myall:You know isn't that fun? Yeah, definitely, definitely fun. So what's been the most surprising part about the publishing journey to you so far?
Rebecca Dazenbaker:oh, that is a good question. I think um gosh, hmm, I think um gosh, I all of it and yet none of it. I don't know. Like I I always tell my kids, like you know, even with like my photography business, like when I was building it up, like I went to my husband when I wanted to take it full time Cause I was doing it on the side and I was like I know this will happen. Like it's not a like I hope it will happen. Like I know this will happen, it's just a matter of getting there.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:And I told him the same thing when I started querying. I was like I know this book will get published, I just don't know when. And like I just felt that strongly like that this story was meant to be told. As I don't know how crazy or wackadoo and I get in this conversation, but like part of my like psyche is like okay, like I'm telling this story because it had to be told, and that's like part of me is like thinks I didn't actually write it. It just kind of like okay, all right.
J.D. Myall:This is weird. Sadiqa Johnson she's a New York Times best-selling author. Yeah, she's also my mentor at Drexel and I interviewed her recently and she said something very similar. Yeah, she said she thinks that, basically, that novels are almost like little embryos that are waiting to be born. Yeah, she's like the universe is giving you the story, but if you don't write it, the universe will give it to somebody else and you just gave me chills. She's like you'll read about somebody else doing your book that you didn't know. No connection. No connection to.
Rebecca Dazenbaker:So that's how I felt this whole time and I guess part of it, I guess the surprising part is like getting on the other side of that and being like I was right, like I mean literally like my website and like now, if you scroll to the very bottom of it it says hashtag chase your dreams. Until I got the book deal, it was hashtag it will happen, and that was my query tracker. Like username was it will happen. Because I was like I have to just keep telling myself like it's, like it's determined already, like this is going to happen that wraps up today's craft chat chronicles with jd mayor.
Speaker 4:thanks for joining us. If you liked the episode, please comment, subscribe and share. For show notes, writing workshops and tips, head to JDMeyercom. That's JDMeyercom. While you're there, join JD's mailing list for updates, giveaways and more. Got questions or want to share your thoughts? Contact JDMeyercom.