%20(2).jpg)
Craft Chat Chronicles
Craft Chat Chronicles
Episode 5: Crafting Futures: Jill Tew's Journey into Dystopian Romance and Diverse Fiction
What if you could transform stress-filled corporate days into successful storytelling? Our guest, Jill Tu, did just that. We talk about her inspiring journey from high-demand corporate jobs to becoming the debut author of "The Dividing Sky," a cozy dystopian romance set in a hyper-capitalist future. Jill's story begins with a pivotal moment of inspiration after watching the movie Divergent, reigniting her passion for storytelling and setting her on a relentless writing journey even while caring for a newborn.
Uncover the creative process behind "The Dividing Sky" and the personal inspirations that shaped its unique premise. Jill contrasts its rapid creation with her first book, which took years to write. She also shares her experience across genres, including her upcoming middle-grade contemporary novel, "Kaya Morgan's Crowning Achievement," which celebrates Black joy and resilience. This episode shines a light on the importance of representation in sci-fi and fantasy spaces and the dynamic world of querying and securing a literary agent.
From winning a contest that provided crucial editorial guidance to the excitement of receiving an offer from her dream agent, Jill’s narrative is filled with perseverance and triumph. We'll walk you through the steps leading up to her book launch, the significance of community recognition, and the excitement of planning for launch events. Jill shares practical tips for crafting compelling characters, managing expectations, and creating resonant endings that leave a lasting impact on readers. Join us for an episode brimming with insights and inspiration for aspiring writers.
Keywords:
afronauts, podcast, debut author, Bestselling Author Tips, Historical Fiction, Crafting Bestsellers, Publishing Industry Insights, Writing Strategies, Author Success Stories, Writing Career Transition, Writing Craft, Narrative Development, Book Marketing Strategies, Creative Writing Techniques, NY Times Bestselling Process, Author Interviews, Book Promotion, Literary Agents, Real Life Experiences, Publishing, Writing Tips
Commercial before HG release.
Welcome to Craft Chat Chronicles, the go-to podcast for tips on crafting best-selling fiction. Here at Craft Chat Chronicles, we bring you expert interviews, insights and tips on writing, publishing and marketing. For workshops, show notes and more information, visit jdmyall. com.
J.D. Myall:On episode five of Craft Chat Chronicles, we have debut author Jill Tew. Jill is host of the Afro Knots podcast that talks about all things writing and publishing from a Black perspective, and she is the debut author of the novel the Dividing Sky. Again, J jill Tew is host the debut author of the novel the Dividing Sky and co-host of . The Dividing Sky is available wherever books are sold. Welcome, jill. So tell me about your publishing journey.
Jill Tew:Yeah, let's see. So I started writing, you know, with a view towards like finishing a novel at some point, um, uh, I guess about 10 years ago now. Wow, yeah, 10 years ago now. Um, yeah, I, um I loved right when I was in school and I was a kid and my parents were like great, you know, but, um, that's not gonna pay the bills. Like, you're good at other things that will make money, so go ahead and do those things instead.
Jill Tew:Um, so I went to school and, um, you know, did a lot of like very like corporate high demand, like startup-y type jobs, um, but I always felt like there was something calling me back to storytelling, um, and so I remember, like walking out, I loved like sci-fi and like those kinds of stories when I was a kid and uh, kind of just grew away from it and didn't have time and was focused on my career, and some coworkers decided to go see Divergent when it came out and I was like great, like sure, like I'll go ahead and read the books yet, but like sounds good, and I went and like, walking out of that theater, I was like this is how I want to feel. Like for the rest of my life I've been missing this feeling for so long. I want to feel this way again, um, and that night I went home and I started working on the book that eventually got me my agent, like seven or eight years later. So, so, yeah, so I got my agent and then, um, uh, about a year later, started working on the story that ended up being my debut and um, and yeah, and here we are. So, yeah, it's been kind of a crazy journey, lots of weird um turns.
Jill Tew:You know, I queried for you know a couple of years, that book. Uh, the government agent, um, got a lot of, like full requests but it wasn't quite hitting on the promise of the premise and I ended up being very lucky to get, uh, to win a contest to have my that manuscript edited by um foe, who's a, I think, hugo award-winning, now um editor, who was a tour for a while and now is at um air one, and um, I worked with her for a year, I think, on that manuscript, um, and ended up getting an agent. But, um, yeah, it was a lot of, a lot of um me knowing what I wanted my story, my writing, to be and not quite knowing how to get there and finding people who were lucky, or I was lucky enough, um, to take the time to tell me everything that was wrong with what I was doing.
J.D. Myall:So, yeah, now um the contest. Was that a twitter contest or some other contest?
Jill Tew:it was. It was announced on twitter. I found it on twitter, um, and basically you had to. It wasn't like a pitch contest, so you had to submit your entire manuscript. So I was lucky, that was, I think it was announced in the summer of 2020. I was lucky that I, you know, had the manuscript ready to go, so by then I probably had like the last act of my book ready, like almost finished, when my youngest was born. So she was born in October 2019.
Jill Tew:And I was like you know what.
Jill Tew:I have quit this story so many times like I'm not quitting again, I'm gonna finish it. And so she was born and I was. I'm writing every day. I don't care, like I know, like fourth trimester, like horrible, like so tired, so exhausted, um, but I would commit to writing a page every day, 250 words every day, like on my phone under my blanket while she was like self-soothing or like I was feeding her. Um, and I finished, I finally I typed like the end in, like May, I want to say 2020. Um, and it was trash. It was so bad, I was so tired, um, I was like who wrote the last few chapters of this book?
Jill Tew:It's like, it's like barely legible, um, but it was finished and so I was able to at least have something to submit when it came time to submit to that contest and I scrambled to kind of finish revising and like just cleaning up, like literally just the prose and like just the gobbledygook of that last act, um, in time for the submission deadline. And I made it. But I knew, you know still, that it wasn't quite where I wanted it to be as far as like the quality of that of that story. So I kept revising, you know, as time went on and some friends of mine had also submitted to that contest and they, you know, around like September they got notifications of like oh, you were the third prize, second place, second place winner. You know, here's your kind of like.
Jill Tew:Second prize is like a query, something like that was like oh, I guess I didn't get it, I haven't heard anything, so it's not on the list at all, um, and then I got an email from diana in october. It was like you won, and I was like I won like one one um. And now it's incredible, um, and like you know, it's what I wanted, right, I I am. I actually had gotten an offer, um from a very, very, very junior agent for that manuscript manuscript about a month prior to that. Who?
Jill Tew:was just like you know story's ready to go, like let's, let's like pick some typos, we're ready to submit it, and I was like no, we're not, like I can tell you right now that story is not where I want it to be, and that difference in vision and a difference in like standards, honestly was enough for me to say like thanks but no thanks. Was enough for me to say like thanks but no thanks. I don't want to work with you, um, because I was looking for someone like Diana who was going to take my manuscript and tear it apart and say like here's where, here's what it could be, and like give me permission. I think in some ways, to to really push myself and and to take it to, um, a different place.
J.D. Myall:I love that. Um, tell me a little bit about your novel, the Divid divided sky yeah, so this, yeah, this story, um, it's funny.
Jill Tew:My first book, um, died on submission. I think I might revisit it. I've been kind of thinking about it a lot lately, but my first book took me seven or eight years to write. Uh, the dividing sky took me 90 days.
Jill Tew:Um, this book was kind of like poured out of me, um, and essentially it is, uh, people call it like a cozy dystopian, which that's impossible, but it is kind of like a cozy, heartwarming, uh dystopian romance about a girl who uses her neurochip to illegally deal happy memories and a handsome rookie who's determined to arrest her. Um, and it's set in this world that I kind of refer to as um Jeff Bezos's fever dream. So you know the founder of Amazon, um, because it's very hyper-capitalist. It's a world in the near future, 24th century, where everybody works super aggressive hours for this company that really controls everything, and you have the wealthy white-collar upper-management workers who are just so busy working that they don't have time to live life for themselves, and so what this company has done to keep them happy and productive is to have the lower class people in this society become proxies, and so proxies live different aspects of the upper class people's lives for them. You know they'll raise their kids, they'll deliver their groceries and, you know, run errands for them.
Jill Tew:They'll also go on dates on their behalf and they will um look at the sunrise for them, they'll read books for them, they'll see movies for them, um, and all these things they upload via neurochip to their upper clients um brains so that they will kind of feel like they have those experiences themselves.
Jill Tew:And you know, I wrote this at a time when I was doing those kind of very high um I was. I thought of this idea when I was kind of in those really high stress, high demand jobs where I was outsourcing a lot of my life. I was outsourcing dog care and laundry and food delivery and all the stuff that we think about, and I was never filling the time that I gained back from that outsourcing with fulfilling things for myself. I was filling with more work all the time that I gained back from that outsourcing with fulfilling things for myself. I was also dealing with more work all the time. And so I was like, well, like you know, let's think about a future where technology catches up to that idea. You could outsource pretty much anything. You know at what point would somebody say, like actually, you know, I'm done with like striving for efficiency, like I want to live like a fulfilled, like truly joyful life. Um, that kind of like was where the idea for the story was born.
J.D. Myall:I love that. I also like that you're a sci-fi fantasy nerd, because I am too. Yeah, there's not a lot of us you know it's weird.
Jill Tew:I my, um, my middle grade, coming out in April, is not sci-fi or fantasy, it's contemporary. But it is about a girl who, um, loves her local Renaissance festival. And I feel like growing up like black and like being into that kind of stuff it was. It was not common to see us like represented in those kinds of spaces. So it's amazing, you know, to make it to this point where we find our community, we find each other and like realize we've been here the whole time, maybe a little bit more isolated than we realized.
J.D. Myall:So Now, was it your plan to write across genres, or is that something, that kind of publishing?
Jill Tew:it really wasn't. It's so funny because so I, um, my middle grade Kaya Morgan's crowning achievement was actually originally a short story. There was an anthology called um Karen Strong, who, um, is an amazing author. She had an anthology come out last January called called cool, awkward black and it was just about like looking for stories um, you know, there were a lot of like published established authors that were part of that, but they also had an open call for unagented, um kind of fresh voices, um, just stories of like awkward blackness of all kinds, whether you know, across genres, and I came up with this, uh, this renaissance festival story as a ya story originally.
Jill Tew:Just really like thinking about back to like my days of growing up. My dad was a huge like Renaissance Festival nerd and you know how strange it felt to be like into those things but also have your blackness questioned and like all these kinds of things kind of bubbling up and having to prove yourself in all directions, kind of like the complicated nature of that. So the YA short story I did not make it into that anthology and so I kind of like the complicated nature of that. This is a YA short story, um, and did not make it into that anthology, um, and so I kind of just like put it on the back burner because, like YA contemporary short stories, like there aren't a ton of markets for that, like it's like where do you put that after that? Um, so it's kind of like like table. That is. I love the story but, like you know, it is what it is.
Jill Tew:Um, and then, uh, in like November of last year 2023, no, 2022, excuse me my agent got an email from Disney Hyperion, which was starting a new imprint called Freedom Fire, led by Kwame Mbalia, who wrote the Tristan Strong Punches a Hole in the Sky series, and that was they were looking for proposals and that was they were looking for proposals and you know they were looking for middle grade primarily, maybe lower YA, looking for proposals of, you know, stories of black joy and resilience, and I was like I might have something actually.
Jill Tew:So I took that YA short story and I aged it down. I was like this actually feels like it might make more sense as middle grade, and so I aged it down and wrote, you know, a couple of chapters and the synopsis, you know, because I had the story in my head so clearly. From the short story I just kind of fleshed out the full story and we submitted it in November and I think by February we had the offer, um and so yeah. So for me it was, it was more just like a story that like came out of like my lived experience. I always thought that I would just be a straight like sci-fi author, like across maybe across age categories.
Jill Tew:But I didn't ever think about writing in contemporary which kind of like happened, which is kind of funny, um. So now we're into the um, into the phase we're talking about it like a book two in my Disney contract and it's like, well, am I going to stay in contemporary? I'm trying to go back to my roots as a sci-fi author and kind of figure out like what that looks like.
J.D. Myall:So yeah, it's kind of a funny, just series of events tell me about um your quarrying process with um well in general, and yeah, yeah.
Jill Tew:So so I finished that story um that uh, adult is like an adult, um parallel universe story, which I love dearly, um, and I uh started querying it in like june 2020. It was sort of ready.
Jill Tew:I was like, you know, you know takes a while for it.
Jill Tew:Just to get back to you, I'll throw some, throw some things out there super high concept. So I got a lot of nibbles really fast and just like that sounds great, I want to. And I like, uh, pit mad was still a thing.
Jill Tew:I don't remember pit mad, so like on, like the twitter pitch contests, it was really hitting because, like, the concept was super high, um, easy to communicate and, um, I would submit my fulls and just get rejected or just like crickets for a while. Um, because, like I really like looking back on it now that the story did not deliver on the premise was fire, the manuscript did not quite deliver on that premise, and so I got to a place where I had a bunch of fulls out because people were kind of really interested in the story, and I, um, got that offer from that junior agent and I this is like a cautionary tale for authors everywhere Got that offer from that agent before I had even spoken to them. I emailed everyone that had a full out and I was, like I've got an offer, like yeah, yeah, yeah, so like you've got two weeks to respond. Amazing, the more I sat on it, the more I was like you know, I don't think I'm going to take this offer.
Jill Tew:I actually think that I'm not um vibing with like the you know the plan for where we go from here. Uh, just don't feel like it's the right move for me, and I, the the rejection started coming in. So once you, once you say like you've got two weeks, everyone's like, oh, I don't have time, or like oh, you've landed somewhere Great, and so I ended up having no agents. I turned her down, I ended up having no more fulls out because everyone closed my submission and I got no feedback, because they were like oh, you've got an agent, so you don't need my notes. So I ended up in this place where I was like okay, what am I going to do?
Jill Tew:And so I was looking at like doing a full overhaul on my own. You know if I hadn't gotten into this contest with Diana, but luckily I did. So I started querying in 2020, june-ish and then took everything off of submission to agents in October, when we started working together. And then it took me about a year after that to do the revisions that Diana recommended for me and then my business was ready to go in October 2021. That's when I got my offer from Jenna Zantian, who's my agent now, who's fantastic, and so, yeah, it was just kind of one of those things where you kind of have to go slow to go fast, where, like knowing that something isn't the right fit for you and like not not being so eager to jump the gun and say, like wait, like agent in hand, perfect, let's do it. Because I think, had I taken that offer, you know, I wouldn't have been eligible for Diana's contest. I wouldn't have ended up with an agent who really could work with me, um, over the longterm of my career.
Jill Tew:Um that is very like strategically oriented and very editorial, which I love, um, and so all those things were a better fit for me, um, but if I'd gone for like the bird in the hand, then I probably I might still be, you know, having things languish on sub honestly now, how was that first call with the agent?
J.D. Myall:how did that go? Did she email you first? Did she just call?
Jill Tew:so actually it's really okay. So this is really funny. So okay, um. So as part of the contest, there were a handful of agents that were like I want to first read of this manuscript when it's ready to go. And Jen was one of them and we actually had like a prior relationship because oh, you froze, you're still there, sorry, but you're still okay. Um, because she was never she's like never open to queries, like she's like so busy and like her, like her, like, um, inbox is so full, but if you ever have something on her manuscript wish list then she'll, then she'll take you.
Jill Tew:And months before my manuscript was done actually when I was still in the early querying stages she tweeted something that was I had the craziest dream that I could talk to myself in another universe. If you have a book like this, I really want to read it. And my friend texted me at 11 o'clock and I was just like Jill, she's got your book, she wants a book just like yours. And so I tweeted'clock and I was just like Jill, she's got your book, like, she wants like a book just like yours. And so I tweeted her and I was like I have exactly this, like can I submit it to you and I did. She didn't get it to me by the time I got the end of the contest, and so I was like, well, you know, I'm going to revise it anyway, like she's part of the like the group of agents that wants to see it Like my best work.
Jill Tew:And so for a year we paused and then, um, you know, cut to the next year when the magazine was ready to go and I had, um I had also submitted to this additional agent outside of the side of the contest who I knew was really good and also really fast at like reading reviews. It's like I I would love to work with him. I think he's really great, he's like getting like so snatching up really good talent. I want to make sure I get in there before he's full, and so I submitted it to him.
Jill Tew:I got an offer and I was like ready to go and I was like so excited, um, but I wanted to give everyone else the two weeks, and so I reached out to Jen and I was like I know that you're slammed, you know two weeks is like crazy, um, but we have like a history with this manuscript, so like if you um, if you know like I would love for you to take some time, if you can get to it, to like read this manuscript. I feel like it's you know, we've kind of bonded on this over the past year, so, okay, I'll try. And then the deadline gets like closer and closer. It's like, well, it's not going to happen. I'm like an early morning writer, so I got up early to write. I remember this was sitting in my kitchen over my laptop and she's liked like three of my tweets.
Jill Tew:And I was like that's interesting.
Jill Tew:And then I went to my inbox and then she was like, can we chat?
Jill Tew:And I was like oh my gosh, and so that was really cool. And then, talking with her, I was like this is great. I think it's hard to at the time, even still, but at the time this was like two years ago there were not a lot of agents who were excited about sci-fi. Sci-fi was a hard sell in any age category. Fantasy, you know, still rules the day even today, but at the time, like there really was not a lot of sci-fi out there and so it was really awesome to talk to an agent who, like loved it as much as I did and like really believed in the stories. It was going to go to bat for them. So that was great love that.
J.D. Myall:When they like your stuff on social media, that's a good sign oh yeah yeah, I mean they're curious about you, which means they probably liked your work. Yeah exactly.
Jill Tew:I was like. I don't want to like presume, but I feel this is a good thing. The offer was in my in my inbox.
J.D. Myall:Yeah, it was great so how was the submission process for you?
Jill Tew:yeah, so that book that I, that I got that Jen and I started working together on. You know, at the time it's so funny, like the trends and like you know I haven't even been in the game that long but like you see, the trends kind of come and go. So at the time, adult sci-fi I think it was either super literary or very like commercial zippy, almost like military sci-fi, and my book was none of those things, and so you know, we got a lot of feedback.
Jill Tew:That was, like you know, jill's a great writer. The story felt a little bit familiar, or you know, just like didn't know where to place it. And so, you know, we were, we were on top on that one for, you know, for a year before it was like, well, I think this isn't the better version of the story, like now I'm a stronger writer for it. So I, you know, I ignored it. Like while we were on sub, I wrote the dividing sky and, um, we went out on sub with that in. Um, what was that? I guess it would have been August of 2022. So, yeah, we were on sub for like a full year with another story. I was like, well, I have this other book, let's just do this instead. So we went on top of 2022.
Jill Tew:And that was August and I had doings, ends and revisions to it. And then, six weeks later, we had an offer which was amazing From my dream. In front of it, I was like, if there's anyone that I want to see the story, it's this one, which is Droid Revolution. And yeah, we had an offer and I was like, great, like let's do it. So, yeah, that was you know. So that takes as long as it takes. But I was like I paid my dues, like I'm ready for, I'm ready for it to go well, so so I got really lucky. And then you know, of course, being on submission for Kai Morgan was, you know, an even more different kind of story, because it was a proposal and that worked out. So so yeah, like I think you gotta go to slow, gotta go slow, to go fast, and I think in publishing a lot of times, it can be a lot of nothing, a lot of waiting and then like everything happens at once.
Jill Tew:So so yeah, and how was the editorial call? It was good, I mean, it was long ago, so I'm trying to think of like what it was. Like you know, it's funny. So when I wrote the Dividing Sky I knew that it was kind of like strangely halfway between like a true dystopian adventure and the romance, and I was like, like you know, depending on who wants to acquire this, I'm gonna have to change things around, and so joy revolution is a romance imprint and so most of their notes were.
Jill Tew:You know we have some big notes about the ending and kind of how big it is and how we can bring the scale down and make it focus on the relationship, and I was like that makes a ton of sense, and so I knew going in that it was going to be a lot of work, um, to make that work.
Jill Tew:And I think you know there was a little bit of a healthy tension, a good tension, um, between me and brian the unions on, like, um, the romances of it, without taking the teeth out of the dystopia, right, because you wanted to feel gritty, you wanted to feel real and have something to say, um, but also swoony and banter and like all the fun parts of having a romance, um, and so, um, combining those two things. I think you know we had, we both had a lot of good push and pull and I feel I love where we ended up. The story, the book as it is now, is like the book of my dreams. I love it so much and, yeah, it wouldn't have happened if we hadn't had like a really healthy, like ongoing dialogue about you know exactly how to get there.
J.D. Myall:So love that. Um so the initial. Did you have an initial call with the agent after submission?
Jill Tew:or after submission. No, so we just kind of we like we've gone back and forth on edits and like on just revisions and stuff, and then, uh, and then it was out, yeah. So then, um, she called me. Yeah, so I think, uh, it was funny she, she was on vacation and I saw a tweet from Jen that was like all I have to do to go to get a bunch of offers is go on vacation, I guess, and I was like, oh man, I wish she was talking about me. And then, like two hours later she calls me and she was like we have an offer. That was really exciting. Like the call, you know, from the agent to say that someone wants your work is always like a really magical moment.
J.D. Myall:So yeah, yeah, so walk me through how the debut process went for you. You're further along than myself and some of the other debuts I've interviewed. Some of the people are like you know just at the beginning. Yeah, so walk me through.
Jill Tew:Like what it looks like yeah, I mean, I don't know. So let's see, I mean, like it's, it depends on everyone's different. You know, for me, um, we signed in like november of 2022 and then I got my first edit letter in january and spent a few months on that um and then, um, yeah, like most, 2023 was just mostly on revisions and stuff, and then, by 20, by like the fall, we were locked for story, like we were like this is the story, story it's faked Because they had to go to launch. So they did their internal launch where the editor basically gets in front of the different publishers. But at Random House, the editor gets in front of the teams marketing, publicity, sales, sub rights and does the here's the book and here's the cover and here's how we're pitching it. And they talk about putting the of. Does the like here's the book and here's the cover and here's how we're pitching it.
Jill Tew:And um, you know, they kind of talk about, you know, like, putting the team together to like do the marketing, all those things, pick a sales, pick an on sale date, um, and so once that began to happen, you know, it kind of felt like things were like my book had been like acknowledged into, like the broader, like machine of thing, random house, as opposed to just like a secret that my editor and I were keeping. And yeah and like even then, you know you have some like things are happening behind. There's like more bustle and hustle and like you're hearing from people in different departments like random emails here and there, but it's not like oh my gosh, this is happening. I think you know it happens step by step. At that point we're like you're looking at, this is real, this is real. It's like now it's very real.
Jill Tew:You know we had the cover reveal in February. That was like a big thing where it was like okay, like you can buy it, now it's on sale places and as a broader, like a bookish community kind of like becomes more aware of the book and the cover is gorgeous. I mean you can see it there. But the um love it. But the cover, I think like that was a big thing, was like oh damn, like we're, we're doing this, like we're releasing a book.
Jill Tew:Um, and you know I was lucky enough to have a lot of like other debut friends. We would be like be like Sarah doesn't mean it. Like we read other stories a lot and a lot of them were like this book is amazing and I was like, wow, now everyone else thinks so too. Um and um, the coolest thing to me has been having it up on NetGalley. So to me I think, going into this, obviously you think, well, my pub date is October 8th. October 8th is when the book's out in the world. I think what I wasn't expecting was how important the acknowledgement of the bookish community was going to be to me, such that my book going up on net galley felt much more like the book being out in the world than like the actual on sale date.
Jill Tew:And so when the book went up on net galley, that was what, like a month ago, month and a half ago, um, that was like whoa, like it's really out there, like any like people that, like people that I you know, people that I like identify as like I'm a bookish person, I have bookish people looking like and like there's a lot of like um love for books and storytelling in the story, like in the book, and so it's like, wow, they don't like this, like no one's gonna like this um, and so that felt really real to me of just like um, you know, now it can be like totally and truly perceived and I do feel like you know, october 8th is going to be huge and I and I, um, I and so when you can pay money for the book, that's always great um, so I can keep doing this um.
Jill Tew:But in some ways I feel like it's out there now and it can be like enjoyed and shared and like reach people that it needs to reach um and like find its people. In some way that feels like like the tangible with the real, like release to me love that.
J.D. Myall:Do you have any plans around launch like?
Jill Tew:things are coming together.
Jill Tew:I mean, I we're lucky to have a really amazing, um, like YA book community here in Atlanta lucky to have, um, you know, people here in bookstores here that really support the community, and so I have a friend who works at um Brave and Kind in Decatur, and so we're probably going to do like some sort of event with them. Um, you know, it's interesting. Like I think debuts like and I like I will say this, and I mean, like you know, it's easier stuff than believed, I guess. But, like you know, I think debuts as a business major, like I can see how, in the broader scheme of like publishing being a business, a debut author is like a hard sell, right. Like you don't know that the book's gonna hit, you don't know anything about this person, like they're not a tried and like, true, um, like a known quantity, and so, yes, I know that, like with my intellectual part of my brain and also, like I wrote this book, that is like my whole heart and I want like the biggest splash for it. And, like you know, I think debuts put a lot of pressure on that. Like debut month of like oh, I'm gonna travel here, I'm gonna do this event and I'm gonna go talk on panels and it's like well, like maybe not, you know, if anybody wants me, that'd be great, but I'm trying more and more as things get closer to temper expectations and to say like it's just the first book and hopefully a long career and you know it's a great like introduction to like myself and you know what I believe and what I like to say with my stories. But I'm not, you know, I'm no longer hoping to be like flown out, to like to do different conferences and stuff in that first month, but I'm going to do something here with my community people that I care about that have supported me. And you do something here with my community um people that I care about that have supported me. And you know I'll probably go to um y'all fest and Charles, I love y'all fest. This is so fun in Charleston. I just go every year for fun just to like see friends, um. But other than that, like I'll probably just like chill out and yeah, like not do too much.
Jill Tew:I I do love like what I am looking forward to and what I've always loved is like connecting with people that love the book. So I want to do like bookstore events or like virtual book clubs and that kind of thing. I just love talking to people about the book and the ideas and like I like that about. Like you know, I love that about book books that I love Right. So I want to do a lot of that, not to like generate sales, but just to like connect with people, and so I'm looking forward to that. You know, when the books like officially out, there'll be more of that, I hope.
Jill Tew:Um, but other than that, yeah, like it's not gonna be a big like you know, yeah, I think too, you know it's funny like even that even five or four and a half months out now, um, there's still a lot like in play. Like I think like publishing still is very much thinking about like summer releases right now, um, and so a lot could change. You know, I think publishing still is very much thinking about summer releases right now. A lot could change. I think a lot is still coming together for the fall and different panels are putting together, different conferences are putting together panels.
Jill Tew:Who knows where I'll be, where I'll be asked to go? For now I'm planning on trying really hard to maybe do a big push on the levers I can move this summer, but then once September comes, it's like it's like studying for the SATs like the night before. It's like you either got it or you don't. So I'm gonna try to like just relax, as like October comes closer, um, and you know, try to just see what happens for you have you been to the AAMBC Awards in Atlanta?
J.D. Myall:No.
Jill Tew:I haven't, but I am going to the Black Writers Weekend in August.
J.D. Myall:Yeah, yeah, okay, the awards is like the last, the Sunday Okay, of that event and it's kind of like like the finale of that weekend, okay, and they like last year they gave, was it, last year they honored, was it yeah?
Jill Tew:that's right, I saw the pictures. Yeah, that's awesome. Are you going to come?
J.D. Myall:up. I usually go when I'm in Georgia. Okay, I usually come every year. I know Tamika, the founder of the awards.
Jill Tew:Oh cool. Okay, yeah maybe we can meet up.
J.D. Myall:Yeah, definitely Okay. How about social media? Do you have any social media plans?
Jill Tew:So I so I, um, I have found and I do, I do think it's true. So I think, you know, people put a lot of pressure on themselves to do TikTok. I think TikTok is really funny, like I love like making memes and stuff, like I really just enjoy it, just making an idiot of myself on social media, and so when I have the energy and I'm not on deadline, I like to do it and I did, you know, thought about my deadlines for, you know, future books coming up and other contracts, kind of front load as much of my writing as possible this year so that I would have like July and August, let's say, to ramp up on social media stuff. Um, I'm still planning on doing that. I think, um, again, it's mostly for fun. I do know that you know TikTok and it's true that, like TikTok is very much about like instant gratification. So they're not a big like pre-order crowd, they like to buy things that are already out which is fine.
Jill Tew:I'm just gonna have fun with it, um, and maybe raise awareness for the book. I think too, with my marketing hat on, I can say that I feel like TikTok, unlike any other social media platform that I've seen, is the best for what you think of as top of the funnel. So reaching people that have no idea who you are. It can be hard to find those people. I think you know Instagram and especially Twitter are like such echo chambers that can be hard to find people that have like that might be like totally oblivious to like your book or even just you know your genre. In general, tiktok's really good at that, and so I do think that you know, while it is exhausting and you can burn yourself out, you know, trying to like optimize for stuff. I don't plan on doing that much, but it is. It is unique in that sense that, like you're trying to find people that have no idea who you are and introduce you for the first time, like it's it's it's a pretty good medium for that.
J.D. Myall:Love that, love that. What do you think was your biggest learning experience throughout this debut year?
Jill Tew:Huh, I mean, I'm still having them. So to date, I don't know, to date I probably would say I think, like I mean I knew this with my head, I think, going in, but I think I like feel it more with my heart now, which is like how important it is like to your like mental sanity and just like being able to persevere in this, to just be a realist, I think like it is great to hope and like we're all here writing books because we're a little bit delusional and that's great, like we need that to create more stories. But you know, like the odds are like 99 to one that you're not going to be a breakout, right, like it's just like it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't happen that way. And the reason we love those stories is because they are so rare and it's amazing, I think, to think of. Like you know, but what if it's me? And that's great.
Jill Tew:The closer things get, I think, the most, the more important it is to think of like the most likely good scenario. Right, like most likely good scenario is like you will connect with readers and maybe booksellers that love what you do and, excited for your next thing, you will build a readership. You will, you know, love what you do and excited for your next thing. You will build a readership. You will, you know, brick by brick, build this like really stable, um, enthusiastic readership and fan base. Like that sounds great.
Jill Tew:Um, and I am like trying more and more to ground myself in that right that I want this book to find its people. Not that I want to be like chosen for some crazy book club or whatever. Um you know, because like that doesn't, like I can't control that and I can't, I can't control like most of it, but like the odds are that that's not going to happen, like for a debut, just like the slim, like the odds are just slim to none. Um, so I'd rather spend my time thinking about like reaching those people and like writing the next book for those people than like waiting for some random, like dream come true one in a million email to hit my inbox because the driver's a little crazy very true, very true.
J.D. Myall:That's a good outlook to have. Okay, let's move on to a few craft tips. Writers, who'd love to be in your shoes. Um, how do you master voice and making each character's voice distinct?
Jill Tew:master voice. Yeah, I, I don't know if I've mastered voice. I, I love you know it's funny. I'm a big um audiobook listener and sometimes I'm getting into a new age category. Let's switch in between projects, right? So I'm going from white dystopia to middle grade contemporary, where she's like a black girl's urban atlanta very different book. Um, I will listen to like a few chapters of an audiobook.
Jill Tew:Like, in that space, to be like this is what it literally sounds like, to like have the character and I, you know, I usually write first person, so it's easy for me to be like, you know, I, et cetera, et cetera, like put myself in the character's actual shoes and headspace, and so that's a really helpful tip for me to just like quickly get back in the zone. And, yeah, when I'm writing, I think I do, you know, feel like somebody's talking to me, right, I do feel that I'm having a conversation with this person about what's going on and the you know, the jokes and the like references to like things that happened earlier in the book. It feels like, you know, it was someone's lived experience and so it kind of helps me to feel grounded in this sense of reality. Right, I think you know your voice and your world building really go hand in hand, right? The jokes, the asides, the things your character notices that they all have to be part of your world, and so they kind of inform each other.
Jill Tew:You know, for the Binding Sky, that book is dual POV and so you have two different voices that are kind of going back and forth and they're kind of from different kind of experiences in this world, and so, you know, changing what they notice, changing what's important to them, changing you know how they think that their friends or co-workers would react if they were, if they knew what was going on with their heads, right?
Jill Tew:Um, all those things had to be different and distinct and, um, you know, it's always fun when you have dual pov in a romance because you know they're never on the same page until the very end, and so you can play a lot with that, like what one person knows and feels and what the other person knows and feels, and creates a really fun tension that way too. So, yeah, I think you know, for me it's just keeping it conversational, you know, keeping it, keeping it like relevant to like that real person, right, and really trying to like put myself in their shoes and think about, um, you know, a real person in front of me telling me what, what is happening to them in the moment love that.
J.D. Myall:How do you hook a reader in the early pages of the book?
Jill Tew:um, yeah, I think I've gotten better at this. I think, think you know, I I never had the issue of, like she woke up one day and the sky outside was gray, I just like I always look, I think what's the what's the? What is the most important thing I want you to know about my character? Maybe, maybe the three most important things, right, Whether it's the world or like's going on in there, like for the plot, right, whatever those three things are for, like that opening chapter, my goal is to prove it to you. So if I say that, like, I want you to know that my character is, uh, you know, compassionate, or like you know, hunger games, right, so, like they want you to, like suzanne collins wants you to know that, like katniss cares about her sister, um, she doesn't say, like my name is Katniss and I care a lot about my sister, um, she shows you, right the first thing she does when Katniss wakes up and she reaches for Prim, right, um, she thinks about Prim all the time. She tells you that, like, she hates animals and hates cats, um, but she kept the cat alive for Prim, right, um, those things are, um, hooking the reader because they give you, like, a, an actual character to root for.
Jill Tew:Like you care, like you're like, oh, this character is really hard, but you're like that's interesting to me, but it also doesn't just like lay everything out for you. It has to. It kind of pulls you in. You feel you're getting to know Katniss, or or you know my character, liv. Um, by what I'm showing you, just like you would a real person, as opposed to just like. This is how I feel about this thing.
Jill Tew:Right, because that's like that's not interesting. Like if somebody met you at like a dinner party and they're just like here's what I think about. You know about, I don't know, gardening. You're like, okay, well, that's kind of interesting. They're like, oh, I was out in the garden the other day and I noticed the way the sun was hitting the flowers, etc. Etc. You're like, oh, that's interesting. This person really like cares and notices things and has attention to detail. Um, that's much more intriguing than just like on the nose, like telling you bit by bit you know about their life. So, um, so yeah, I think like it's the same as any relationship really. Um, these kind of show facets that suggest a hidden depth and um kind of pull the reader into the story and how about the middle?
J.D. Myall:how do you avoid the saggy middle? How do you get? Oh man, if anybody has?
Jill Tew:tips out there. I'm all like, my, my dms are open. Uh, the middle, I think, um, for me, like, I am a plotter and so I do think in terms of like outlines and that kind of stuff, um and like, for me, you know, each act is characterized by like a change in goal of some kind, and so, um, the key is just to make sure that that that second act goal is like really juicy and worth worth striving for, right, um, you know, I've heard of like try, fail, cycles, right. So if they have that goal, showing them like, trying to like achieve it in like two or three different ways and then, like, you know, ultimately you know, getting there, I think all those things would be really helpful.
Jill Tew:Um, I think, like, in some ways, I mean, you know, like, honestly, like in some ways, you do have a little bit of room to be a little bit soggy in the middle, um, because you're, by then your character, or your readers, invested in your characters, um, and you can play around a little bit with like more banter or more like quiet relationship building moments or whatever Um, cause, those parts are good too, um, it doesn't all have to be like, be like, go, go, go as far as the plot is concerned, um, but it needs to be. I think, what I, what I, when I read a book and I feel like the middle is dragging, so I feel the characters have forgotten what they're doing, like why we're doing this right, and so I think the key to that is having a really compelling goal that the characters are really striving for, um, even in the midst of whatever else you want to put in there to kind of um, to beef up the story now.
J.D. Myall:Your story also has a strong romantic subplot. Can you give any tips or tricks to helping people get a good romance?
Jill Tew:yeah, I mean, I would say that the romance is the plot. Everything else is a subplot for my book. So I think, um, yeah, I think you know, it's always good to have some tense dynamic. You know, I think, um, you know, I feel like you know I'm cheating a little bit because I'm doing it in like a speculative sense where you can make up, like you know, the, the stakes of the world are such that like they could never be together because they're like you know, they're like enemies. Right, like in real, you know real situations. You rarely have that like level of like tension and dynamic. So, like, I feel like contemporary rom-com authors are really the masters of creating tension where it's like, oh, is that really that big of a deal? But you're like, yes, this is a huge deal, they cannot possibly be together. Um, in my book it's easy to be like their enemies because you know there's some evil overlord or whatever, whatever, um, but yeah, I think you know, know, I, I love, um, I love dual POV romance in particular, because you can get inside of the character's heads and play with that.
Jill Tew:You know who's falling first, who has all the information, who maybe doesn't want the other person to know how they're feeling. Um, you know, put your characters through the ringer and just like, have it be. Just like this, like these ultimate moments like push and pull, like almost on the same page but not quite. I love playing with that like dramatic irony of the reader knowing you know that, like one person's keeping a secret from the other one, the other person being like I would trust him, like over a cliff. It's like you shouldn't do that because he's lying to you. Those are, those are always really fun moments. And yeah, um and yeah, I don't know. I mean, I think you know like it's, it's like any, any sort of relationship dynamic. You got to prove it. Um, I am not a fan of like insta love as a trope. Like, don't come for me. I don't love insta love because I like to see the chemistry.
Jill Tew:I like to see um. I like to see, I like to see people realize that they're right for each other. I like to see um and it's like I want to see it played out. I I saw on threads there was like a thread months ago from a romance author I don't know if you remember who it was but she was saying you know, she's also like a, you know, qualified, like academic, like in her other life, and she was like and I write romance, right, I'm not you romance, I am like laying the groundwork to state a case that like two people belong together, right, and so, like, over the course of the book, what you're doing is you're laying the groundwork. You're saying, like this person, you know the way they fit together, the way they interact, the way that they solve problems together or don't, makes them the right fit for each other, and you have to kind of lay out your argument to your reader to be like these people belong together and at the end of the day, you either believe it or you don't.
Jill Tew:But I feel like that's, you know, what makes a good romance is like, I think, one of my favorite books from last year last year, yeah, it was last year, kate Goldbeck's you. Again. It's kind of like a Harriet when Harriet and Sally retelling. It's a great movie and the characters in there are quote-unquote textbook unlikable characters, but they are so right for each other. You're like you idiots deserve each other.
Jill Tew:I hate you both, but I cannot deny that you work together and I think that's such a good romance because it's not inserting myself. I don't like this but the romance works so well because they are. They are like interlocking parts of, like a lock, um, you know they're, they're like, they're selfish and they're, you know all like they're, they're blunt and all these things that they don't like. They're not like classic protagonists but they. The romance works because they fit together well, um, and that is what I think makes a good romance. Not that you like want to like date the boy or whatever it is like book, boyfriend et cetera, but that like you can see why those two people make sense for each other.
J.D. Myall:Love that, and how? About the conclusion? What tips do you have for a satisfying conclusion?
Jill Tew:Yeah, I mean, I think it's funny. Like we say, the good stories resonate, right. That's a word we hear a lot, like it resonates with me and like that language and that metaphor, I think is is common for a reason. Um, you know, I think that, um, you know when, when a story is done right, especially at the ending. The ending is the hardest part, um, because it has to echo all those things that came throughout the story before. And so you know, I think that if, if you, if you set up the right that's what the story right, the ending should be inevitable. If you haven't laid your groundwork, then the ending can feel kind of rushed or like not well thought out right, but it should be like, oh, like it's like a chord resolving right, it feels like oh yes, of course this is the end of this work, like it just like pulls everything together and like fits it thematically.
Jill Tew:You know, I think the key is to know what you're trying to say from the beginning and like interweave those parts throughout and you know the when done right. You know, I think the right, the right story, the right ending will kind of just ring like a bell, the way that like things resonate right and hopefully it strikes a chord in the reader as well.
J.D. Myall:Love that. Um, what would you like to tell us that I haven't already asked you?
Jill Tew:Oh man, I don't know, um, yeah, I think so, I think it's. I mean it's trite, but I think it's true. Which is like, yeah, I think so, I think it's, I mean it's trite, but I think it's true. Which is like, you know, people, people tend to assume that like making or like supporting, supporting authors is out here. You know, um, for like, any like, what?
Jill Tew:Like enduring stretch of time, especially a marginalized debut, and so I would just say, like you know, if you think about the books that you've loved and read over the past few years, or even like this past year debuts, especially like, if you could do us a solid and shout extra loud, it makes a huge difference because, like, we're fighting upstream, like for all of this right, like it's, like the, the machine is such, I think more and more publishing doesn't want to take risks on new quantities, that they want to.
Jill Tew:They want to back the like, tested, like the like, kind of like tried and true, like veteran authors and like, I get it again, like they're making money. But don't just assume that because you, you know, because you like know, because you like heart a story on instagram or twitter or whatever, though that author is going to be here tomorrow. Um, you really have to show up for us and we're trying, um, but it's, but it's really hard, like it's. It's surprisingly hard behind the scenes to be able to make a case, um, for for yourself and your books, like it.
Jill Tew:like we're out here writing stories and you know, you see us posting all the glamorous moments, but it is surprisingly hard to fight against the publishing status quo, um to establish a space for ourselves and our stories. So, um, help us out, help us out and, uh, you know, really, really shout, shout loud.
J.D. Myall:I love that. Um, how long did it take you to get your check? I've heard everywhere from six to nine months yeah, let's see.
Jill Tew:So I, we, we did like the deal number in november. I think we. It did take a while. Um, it was about it was about nine months, yeah, well, for disney. It was a for penguin random house. It was about, yeah, seven months, eight months, yeah, yeah, that's right.
J.D. Myall:That's right, yeah, by then, there's no other job that you work seven months and then get paid.
Jill Tew:Yeah, and I know authors that won't write a word until they get paid. And I I get that because it's like what am I?
Jill Tew:supposed to do and it doesn't make it go any faster, unfortunately, but then we'd all do it, um, but but yeah, like it is, it is wild to like we're doing all this for free. I know people that have like announced books with no contract signed, like it's, like it's I don't know, it's crazy. Disney won't pay anything or won't like they won't announce anything until the contract signed either. So like we barely we like we signed that deal February 2023. Yeah, and we just announced it, like in March, so it's been like 13 months.
J.D. Myall:And what's your Disney project? Ip?
Jill Tew:No that was my short story, yeah, so that was just based on yeah, yeah, okay.
J.D. Myall:Yeah, that's awesome. So how have you been building your writer community in Atlanta or online? Yeah, I go to a lot of events, which has been great.
Jill Tew:Like there's like the local bookstores who do a bunch of different, you know, launch events and things like that. I we just did the Decatur Children's Book Festival here a couple weeks ago and I for that, I, I, you know, my book is not out yet, so I was like I'm not going to be on a panel. But I emailed the bookseller who was organizing it and I was like I can moderate, I'm good at moderating, I can ask questions. And she was like, oh, thank god. Um, so she put me on for a few different events, which was great, um, so I just like make myself useful. You know, I liked I love story.
J.D. Myall:I can't believe this is my job, um, and so I'll always I'll always look for opportunity to talk story with people are there any tools um that you found useful or that helped you in the writing process or in your marketing materials or anything?
Jill Tew:Uh, Canva, basically you know nothing, nothing super fancy, Um, and then I use Scrivener for writing. I like Scrivener a lot. Um, I have never used Scrivener.
Jill Tew:Yeah, I like it a lot. I um, I think, um, I need to leave in a off um, but um, it's nice that you can rearrange things. I'm gonna do it by scene, by scene. So if I want to rearrange something, it's like drag and drop as opposed to like I'm gonna start at the end of the scene, like moving it around. So I like it, have you ever tried auto print?
J.D. Myall:no, I've heard of it, though I like it. When I have a scene I can't figure out, I paste it in there and it'll like give you a critique oh, interesting, interesting, huh, okay, that's cool, I'll look that up. That's super interesting. Where can?
Jill Tew:people reach out to you. So I'm on TikTok. Sorry, I'm on Twitter and Instagram at J2Writes, so J-T-E-W-Writes, and then I'm on TikTok at Jill2. All one word.
J.D. Myall:Yeah, that's me. Awesome, awesome. I'm excited for you and this comes out in October. Do you have a date yet? October 8th, october 8th Okay, that'd be great.
Jill Tew:Thank you so much, jd, I really appreciate it, and yeah, as you're getting closer, do you have a season yet? Do you know when your book's coming out Roughly?
Jill Tew:That wraps up today's Craft Chat Chronicles with JD Meyer. Thanks for joining us. If you liked the episode, please comment, subscribe and share. For show notes, writing workshops and tips, head to jdmecom. That's jdmeyercom. While you're there, join JD''s mailing list for updates, giveaways and more.
J.D. Myall:I appreciate your time. Thank you so much for doing this. This is great. Thank you, bye, bye, thank you.