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Craft Chat Chronicles
Craft Chat Chronicles
Episode 3 Unveiling the Art of Dark Academia: Ava Reid on Crafting Bestsellers and Navigating Literary Fame
When the blank page becomes a canvas for a bestselling novel, what's the secret behind the first stroke of genius? Ava Reid, acclaimed author of dark academia's gripping tales, joins us to unravel the artistry of hooking readers from the get-go. She opens up about her own transformation from writing in solitude to embracing the glaring spotlight of success. Her frank discussion on the ebbs and flows of authorship, right down to the Wikipedia page with quirky inaccuracies about her life, offers a rare glimpse into the emotional whirlwind that accompanies literary fame.
Crafting characters that linger in the minds of readers long after the last page is a feat few master, but Ava shares her insights into breathing life into the unhinged protagonists that haunt the corridors of gothic fiction. This episode is not just about the allure of the macabre; it's a roadmap through the labyrinth of the publishing industry, from the mentorship that can change the game for aspiring writers to the pivotal role of agents who champion their authors' careers. The blend of personal anecdotes with practical advice on storytelling structures like the Save the Cat beat sheet ensures that this conversation is both enlightening and grounded in the realities of writing.
As your host, I reflect on my own meandering path to authorship, marked by challenges that resonate with so many who dare to dream of writing. From lessons learned in self-publishing to the revelatory moments that led to a coveted book deal, my story is one of resilience and the relentless pursuit of a passion for storytelling. As we wrap up, the excitement builds for future episodes, where we'll hear from 2025's debut authors. They're gearing up to share the craft that landed them in the publishing world, promising to be an invaluable trove of knowledge for writers at any stage of their journey. Stay tuned as we continue to explore the landscape of literature, one page at a time.
Keywords: writing, traditional publishing, book marketing, making a living with your writing, writing tips, book marketing, promotion, writing techniques, young adult fiction, dark academia, gothic novels, book promotion, audience engagement, marketing strategies, literary agents, publishing, a writer's journey, writing life, tips, publishing story, Ava Reid, J. D. Myall, Drexel University, Writer's Digest, author.
Commercial before HG release.
Welcome to Craft Chat Chronicles, the go-to podcast for tips on crafting best-selling fiction. Here at Craft Chat Chronicles, we bring you expert interviews, insights and tips on writing, publishing and marketing.
J.D. Myall:Welcome to Season 1, episode 3 of Craft Chat Chronicles. Today, we'll be talking to a woman who was number one on the New York Times bestseller list, that's author Ava Reid. She'll give us tips on writing a best-selling dark academia novel and discuss her writing and publishing journey, and a lot more. Stay tuned Things have been going good for you bestsellers list.
Ava Reid:Yeah, it's been a big surprise, honestly.
J.D. Myall:Exciting. How are you liking being a published author?
Ava Reid:It's good. It's good it's more emotionally complex than I expected it to be. I think it's just like you know, with my two previous books they didn't flop or anything horrible like that, but they didn't get this kind of level of attention. So it's just hearing so many people's opinions and being exposed to so many people's opinions even if they're good opinions it's just like information overload to the point where I'm like I need to just stop looking at like any tagged posts and stuff like that because again, even if it's positive, I'm like this is just making me feel too many things okay.
J.D. Myall:Okay, cool, you like in California. I know you recently moved there.
Ava Reid:I've been here since 2018, actually, yeah, but I'm from New York, so very, very different.
J.D. Myall:Okay, so I'll dive in now. What do you believe are the essential elements needed to capture a reader's attention on the first page?
Ava Reid:I have a friend, victoria Lee, who when they this was advice about a query but I think it kind of applies to a first page too, but I think it kind of applies to a first page too is you basically need an interesting character in an interesting world with an interesting problem. And I think that if you can kind of capture all of those three things on the first page which you know can be difficult, but I think if you can capture all those three things, that's a very effective opening.
J.D. Myall:But I think if you can capture all those three things, that's a very effective opening.
Ava Reid:Did you have any like surprises during your publisher? So so many surprises probably too many to count. I think the biggest surprise was just how long the process ultimately takes. I mean, I sold A Study in Drowning in early 2020, late 2020, early 2021. And then it came out in fall of 2023. So it was definitely like a very long process of you know getting through the edits and production and so many people you know having their hands on the book. You know not just your editors, that the copy editors, but like marketing and sales, and you know getting all of that kind kind of feedback. It was, it was it's so involved and it's so it takes so long, which was I think I was prepared for that a little bit, but I wasn't fully prepared for the the extent of it.
Ava Reid:So how did the reality of being a published author differ from what you fantasized about it when you were a young girl, or when you were Um, I mean, I think when I was younger, I mean I'm like zillennial, like kind of right on that cusp, so like I did grow up with the internet, but not at all the way that it is now. Um, so I thought of writing always as like a pretty anonymous thing. I mean, I got my start on like fanfictionnet, writing like warrior cats fan fiction, which, like you know, I'm just doing that anonymously behind an account, um, but that's not really like realistic. You can't really be have that level of anonymity as an author anymore, I mean, unless you're like Otessa Voschbeck. Um, so I I really didn't know when I was younger that it would kind of there would be this level of of like scrutiny about me, not just my works. Um, like, I saw someone made a wikipedia page for me the other day. Like, literally, my husband came in the room he was like, oh no, you're not gonna like this. And I was like what? And he was like you have a wikipedia page now and I'm like, oh my god, um, with a bunch of incorrect information. Mind you, I don't know who put it together, but a bunch of stuff is wrong. So, yeah, I didn't anticipate having to be so present as a person, in addition to just kind of sharing my work.
Ava Reid:How does that feel? I mean, I think it's a double-edged sword, right, and I think most authors will probably say the same thing like getting to connect directly with readers can be really really great and to just hear that you're and know that your work has touched people in all these different ways. And then obviously there's the double-edged sword of that, which is people just having a lot of access to you and kind of demanding your opinions and your takes and your identity to kind of justify the things that you're writing about. And I think, especially now that readers kind of want that more than ever. They want to know you know how your identity kind of connects, that more than ever they want to know you know how your identity kind of connects to your work. And most people, I don't think, mean it in like a hostile way or anything, but I think the impact can be that it feels very intrusive sometimes.
J.D. Myall:I get it. I think for most people it's wanting to see themselves reflected, so they want to hear that you know you identify with this or that, so they can bond with that. But at the same time we all have chapters of our life we don't want read out loud.
Ava Reid:Yeah, I yeah, and I think that again it comes a lot of it comes from a good place, so I try not to be like completely dismissive of it but at the same time it's like you know, if I'm writing about like mental illness and abuse and stuff, I think you can trust that, like this is something that I've been through without me having to elucidate all of these, these details and it's something that touches almost all of us.
J.D. Myall:To be honest with you, yeah, what is your process for creating complex characters?
Ava Reid:um, I so I'm like a thematic writer. So the first thing that kind of comes to me for a book idea isn't necessarily the what of the book but the why of the book, if that makes sense. So like, why do I want to tell this story, what do I want to communicate, what is kind of the central theme or central idea that I want to explore? And then I see everything from even you know the characters, the prose styles, the plot as being reflective of that theme. So it all kind of comes from that, you know, and the idea in A Study in Drowning that I wanted to explore was this idea of stories and you know your heroes failing you and what makes a story true or real or resonant and who gets to tell these stories and who is believed when they do so. Then you know, the characters kind of all sprang from that and they all kind of reflect those themes in a different way.
J.D. Myall:I love that. What do you think makes a good protagonist?
Ava Reid:so, for me, what makes a good protagonist is being a little bit like unhinged and weird. Um, and I think anyone who's read my books will kind of see that that's the case. Um, you know my face. Some of my like favorite protagonists are, like I think I literally have this in my Instagram bio like Mary Kat Blackwood from we have Always Lived in the Castle. I think she's such an incredible protagonist. I love being in her head, like she's so strange and such an interesting character to follow and the way that she sees the world is just so trippy and fascinating to follow. And the way that she sees the world is just like so trippy and fascinating.
Ava Reid:Um, and in a study and drowning effie, the main character is a very, very unreliable narrator. Um, I mean, she literally, you know, struggles with these hallucinations, these delusions, um, and that's to me. I know that a lot of people won't agree, but like, those are the most interesting characters to me. Kind of a hallmark of the got Gothic genre is having these unreliable narrators and being immersed in the mind of someone you can't necessarily fully trust, and that's always really interesting to me.
J.D. Myall:I love that. What other elements do you think are essential to a good Gothic novel?
Ava Reid:no-transcript gothic renaissance but like to me, this very baroque and detailed prose style is like essential to a gothic novel, or at least a gothic novel that I'm gonna enjoy. Um, I really do like the heavily stylized, like melodrama of the gothic style and that's that feels essential to me love that.
J.D. Myall:What makes a good villain in your gothic novels?
Ava Reid:I mean it's funny because gothic novels give the gothic genre gives actually a very good kind of archetype of a villain and usually it's kind of this mysterious and sinister like master of the house. That usually represents like kind of like the old ways and in this you know tradition where we're talking about like the erosion of aristocratic power. He usually kind of represents the like, the clinging to this kind of old, outmoded way of life. Um, and I think that that is kind of that's there in both of my of my Gothic novels. The villains really represent that and I think that's maybe not necessarily essential, but that's kind of the classic Gothic archetype of a villain.
J.D. Myall:Tell me a little bit about your publishing journey. I'm going to go back to crack to. I'm jumping around journey.
Ava Reid:I'm gonna go back to crack too. I'm jumping around, um. So I mean, I have wanted to be a writer, I think since I was again like 11 years old, on the warrior cats fan fiction forums, um, doing my little role plays, but I didn't start like kind of seriously working to get published until like 2018. I just graduated college and I was just I was working at this startup because I live in Silicon Valley. I was working at this AI robotics startup, which was very interesting, and I was just writing and writing and trying to finish my first novel. And then I got into this pitching contest like mentorship program, which actually doesn't exist anymore, but when it did it was like a pretty big deal and a lot of famous books came out of it. So I got in and I was mentored by this amazing author and she kind of like showed me the ropes and, you know, got my book in front of agents and that's how I found my first agent, got my first publishing deal in 2018.
Ava Reid:And that part happened pretty quickly. And then, you know, now it's like six years later and we're three novels in, so it's definitely a protracted process, but before I, you know, wrote what would become my debut. I wrote so many other books that you know we'll never see the light of day and I kind of queried them on and off but never really. I didn't. I didn't really understand, like, what the querying process was like and I basically just like didn't really know what I the querying process was like and I basically just like didn't really know what I was doing. So that was never going to be successful.
J.D. Myall:But it was kind of this mentorship program that I was in that started, started it all well, what um advice would you have for other writers who are just now in the midst of the querying process, and or where you were then?
Ava Reid:um, I'm always like hesitant to give advice about this because querying has changed a lot since I last queried again, like almost six years ago now, and I like the kind of landscape is very different. But I'll refer back to my friend Victoria's advice about how your query needs to have an interesting character in an interesting world with an interesting problem. Another thing is definitely you have to be like reading and know what's selling in your genre. Like I think a lot of agents say that they get queries that are just like your comp title is like Harry Potter and like Blood Meridian and it's like this is not like.
Ava Reid:This is not what's being published right now. Like you need to be reading, you know new releases and keeping up with what publishers are actually buying, um, and instead of you know comic books that are from you know two decades.
J.D. Myall:What were your literary influences?
Ava Reid:Oh, a lot. I mean I draw a lot from the Gothic genre. I collect copies of we have Always Lived in the Castle by Shirley Jackson. I love all of her work so much. The classic Gothic author is like Mary Shelley. Gorman Gast is another book that's been a big influence on me.
Ava Reid:I also really love kind of the tradition of fabulism, like the books of Karen Russell have been really. I remember I picked up her first short story collection from a used bookstore when I was like 19. And I'd been like on a kind of like drought of inspiration in both reading and writing and I picked up that book because the title was awesome. The title is St Lucy's Home for Girls Raised by Wolves and I read it and it was kind of the book where I was like, oh, reading is fun and like style, like prose, style is just as essential as content and I think that that was the book that kind of made me really think that and care so much about style, really think that and care so much about about style. So that and Kelly Link and Helen Oyeyemi are other authors in that tradition who I really, really love and draw a lot from.
J.D. Myall:So you mentioned a minute ago about how you know people need to be aware of what's selling. From your perspective, what do you think is hot right now? What do you think is selling?
Ava Reid:I mean I can only speak to the genres that I write in, so you know SFF and YA, but I mean romanticy is the big thing right now. That's pretty much almost exclusively what I think SFF publishers are interested in buying, If not you know kind of romantic, at least books with a strong romantic subplot, because that's what BookTok wants to read, For better or for worse. I think dark academia is a big trend right now. I think we're gonna see a big renaissance of dystopia because of the ballad of songbirds and snakes and we're seeing a you know kind of renewed interest in in that. Um, yeah, I can't necessarily speak to other genres, but that's, that's what I'm seeing and the genres that I write in so you talked about romanticism.
J.D. Myall:Do you have any advice for creating a good romantic subplot or romance?
Ava Reid:I don't know. I, like all my books, do have romance, but I've never really considered myself to be like a writer of romance. Like I remember when I was revising my first novel, which which has a romantic subplot but that's not really the main plot of the book, and I was getting feedback from my editor about kind of like strengthening the romantic subplot and I was like I don't even know how to do this. And I went to my friend, alison Saft, and I was like, who writes romance? Who writes really, really amazing romance? And I was like, how do I do this?
Ava Reid:And she was like, well, what is like the first? She was like going to talk me through it, like I was a small child. And she was like, so what is the first moment when, like, they realize they're attracted to each other? And I was like I don't know, like I wasn't even thinking about these things while writing Um, um I. So, yeah, I'm not sure I have much good advice about that, but I think that the best romances to me are the ones where the characters find something and the other that they can't find in anyone else and where their kind of wounds are the same. Yeah, I don't think this is my forte as an author, necessarily.
J.D. Myall:That was really good, though I haven't heard that before. Do you have any tips for making the beginning of your story exciting?
Ava Reid:Keeping readers engaged. Basically, yeah, um, again, I feel like I'm not the best equipped to answer, just because I feel like every single book I write, the feedback I get is like the opening is too slow and we need to get to the action sooner. Um, yeah, I don't know. I mean, I think that readers want to feel like or I as a reader want to feel like you're kind of in competent hands and that the author has kind of a strong vision and you can trust that you're gonna, that they're gonna take you there. If that makes sense, it does. Books that I tend to lose interest in are the ones where it feels like the author is just kind of doing whatever is easier for them um, having a strong vision, for you know what they want for the book and being like in control of all aspects of of their craft. You know pro style characters. You know plotting intention.
J.D. Myall:How do you avoid the saggy middle?
Ava Reid:I thought. So I try. I'm not really much of an outliner at all, but I try to follow the Save the Cat beat sheet, which is, I think, like a resource that pretty much every author loves and refers to a lot, but it basically gives you all of these you know, kind of plot beats to follow to make sure that you know you don't lose tension and you keep your readers engaged, and I think that's a super helpful resource for any author. And, you know, obviously you can deviate from that a bit, but I think that's like a great starting point if you're just, you know, starting to kind of map out the plot of your book.
J.D. Myall:Love that. Any advice for making the end compelling?
Ava Reid:and tying things up.
Ava Reid:See, I am someone who actually is okay with endings that are a bit open-ended and still having questions.
Ava Reid:It's funny, my editor tried like two or three times to get me to change the ending of A Study in Drowning because she thought it was like too open-ended. But I don't know, I've always really enjoyed endings where, like you still have some lingering questions and it kind of makes you want to like reread the book and like see if there's you, you know, stuff that you missed or stuff that you're only going to get, you know, in a second read through, um, and you know, maybe consider that you don't need to. You know, wrap everything up neatly with a bow and and some ambiguity is is okay again, as long as you're kind of in control of that, and that's an active choice that you're making, as opposed to just saying, oh, I'm going to leave this, you know, not tied up, just because it's like easier and I don't want to deal with it. I love that, it makes sense. It's just, my process is like extremely chaotic, so I'm trying my best to like not make it sound that way you're doing a great job.
J.D. Myall:How did you get the news that you made the bestseller list and how did you celebrate?
Ava Reid:um, oh my gosh. So I think, again, every writer experience, every author experiences this. Like, I think, again, every writer experience, every author experiences this like stressful, tense week between your release and when the bestseller list comes out, which is, at California time, it's 4 pm on Wednesday. So I was just a complete ball of stress like the entire week.
Ava Reid:And it was horrible on Tuesday or Tuesday and Wednesday because, like, I'd heard from some people that like, oh, publishers get the list ahead of time, so you know, ahead of time, um, and then my editor, my agent, was like no, that's not true. And I was like wow, but like what, if it is? And then, like no one's telling me because I didn't make the list, all this was. It was like it was actually horrible. I was so stressed out, um, and then on Wednesday, again, I was just a ball of stress the entire time, um, and I told my agent to, because New York Times subscribers do get the list sent to them like, just, you know an hour, usually a couple hours, ahead of time, um, and I told my agent to just call me um, if, if it happened, and I was just like sitting there right at this desk.
Ava Reid:I was just like sitting there, like literally wait, like waiting as the time ticked down, waiting, waiting, waiting for the call. Um, and she called me and she I was like did it, did it happen? And she was like yeah, and she was like it's, it's number one. Um, yeah, and I I just like burst into tears, I think, um, and it was just amazing to get the news from my agent too, because she's like, she's like the most important person in my kind of publishing career and like we've been together forever and she's just so supportive and I love her so much so it just felt really special to get the news from her specifically. Yeah, uh, sarah Landis at Sterling Lord. Um, I love her so much. If anyone is like looking for someone to query, 100,000 percent recommend her. I think anyone would be so lucky to be represented by her. Um, and so much of my, like you know, success as an author is owed to her.
J.D. Myall:Um, yeah, what makes that author? Agent or any author agent relationship work from your perspective I think so, most people, I think.
Ava Reid:When they're queer, understandably they focus on, you know, just the sale and they just want their book to sell, which again, very reasonable.
Ava Reid:Reasonable request from an agent is sell my book. But what's just as important is having that support after the sale. And Sarah is actually my second agent and my first agent was the one who got me my book deal, but then she was just kind of like ghosted me basically after she sold it, like she was just not interested in kind of helping me deal with everything that came after. And like that is the really important part is your agent, you know, kind of holding your hand through all this and being able to tell you, okay, this is a normal part of the process, or like no, your publisher is like screwing you over. We need to like talk to them because you know, again, this happens a lot.
Ava Reid:As an author, you basically have no bargaining power with your publisher, which is very cool. So your agent is the one who's basically your advocate to your publisher and you know they're the person who kind of has their finger on the button telling you you know, my agent is always the one that I will send a pitch to or send you know parts of what the book I'm working on and be like. Do you think this is something I should pursue? Like what do you? Do you think this is the right step for my career? Do you think that this will work in the market? So she's the one who I kind of trust on that and just like genuine emotional support. She's talking me off the ledge like more times than I can count. When you know just stuff in publishing is it just really gets to you. So yeah, I think that, excuse me me, your agent is like 100% the most important person um in your publishing journey that's awesome.
J.D. Myall:A lot of writers complain about not feeling like they've had um a lot of support in the marketing and stuff side. Yeah, you experienced that. Or were all of your books very well marketed?
Ava Reid:Oh my God, where to even begin. This is like oh my gosh. So I don't know how much of this you want to use but for a study and drowning. You know, I think the biggest single indicator of how much marketing support you'll get for your book is usually the advance amount. I mean, that's quite literally your publisher communicating to you how much they think your book is worth. And based on the advance amount I got for A Study in Drowning and I sold A Study in Drowning before my first book had even come out so I had no sales record. So you know I didn't expect to be like, you know, giant, you know splashy, auction, whatever.
Ava Reid:And based on the advance amount, you know I knew that it would be kind of a mid list title. I knew it wasn't going to be the lead title for the season or whatever. A lead title is just like the one book per publishing season that the publisher tends to focus the most on and make the biggest deal about. So I knew that that wasn't, you know, going to be a study of drowning and that it was kind of this weird book. It wasn't like super high concept. So I did know that going in, but I was still pretty surprised by how, let's just say, hands off my publisher was. I mean, they told me that as a cost-cutting measure, they were not doing physical arcs, which are just arcs.
Ava Reid:There's advanced copies of the book that you send out to, you know, readers and reviewers to build hype and suspense, and that's one of the most important marketing tools for a book. And they were just like we're not doing that. So I just didn't have those and they didn't run. They ran like one paid ad, I think, and like did like one Goodreads giveaway, like the week of release for like five copies. So I, you know, I was keeping track of kind of these early indicators, you know, amazon ranking, barnes Noble ranking social media statistics, and I ended up sending over to Harper just a document with all of these early indicators and I was like hey, I think that people are really interested in this and like maybe you should take that into account. That was brilliant by the way.
Ava Reid:Yeah, and it they did end up raising the marketing budget for the book. I'm not sure by how much, but it did. It did get them to pay a little more attention again. I don't think that's something authors should have to do because, like, the whole point of traditional publishing is that your publisher is supposed to take care of all of that. Um, but again, it's like this era of social media is a double-edged sword, because you actually can, you know?
J.D. Myall:you can see in real time what's happening, and because you can.
Ava Reid:You know, despite the capricious nature of the algorithm and stuff, you can move the needle on your own as an author, and that was like something that was really essential to, I think, a study on drowning success. I mean, this was kind of definitionally like a word of mouth kind of success, where people just read it and then they told people that they liked it. You know, it didn't have this giant marketing campaign behind it, it didn't even have physical arcs, um, but I think it just. I mean, it's a testament to just the power of readers. Um, and it's been kind of amazing for this to be. The book that's been so successful is the one that was, you know, a word of mouth success, the one that kind of no one in my publisher expected to to be big, that I didn't necessarily expect to be big. Um, I will never take that for granted and I'll never not feel grateful that the book ended up resonating with so many people who just wanted to talk about it.
J.D. Myall:Um, that's exciting, funny. You know good experience. Um purely selfish question Cause I just sold a book. What?
Ava Reid:Oh my God, congratulations. That's amazing. What's your debut?
J.D. Myall:Um, it's a YA fantasy romancy book. It's these time traveling people. It's filled as, like the night circus meets outlander.
Ava Reid:Ooh, that's so cool. What Um? So that's amazing. Congratulations.
J.D. Myall:So what can I expect? What's debut year look like?
Ava Reid:I don't know. Do you know when it's releasing it?
J.D. Myall:was a two-bit deal, so one is 2025 and one is 2026.
Ava Reid:Okay, so you've got some time. Yeah, that's awesome. Sorry, what was your question? I got distracted. What's?
J.D. Myall:debut year like life. What can I expect? Where the challenges, the pitfalls.
Ava Reid:I think one of the biggest pitfalls that kind of really gets people is just the comparison with other books and other debuts, and like that can kind of be like the harbinger of doom for a lot of people is just this constant need to compare to other people and it is really hard to not view other authors as your competition because like in some sense, this is sort of a zero-sum game. You know, if someone else gets that book deal, it means that you don't get that book deal. So that, I think, is really something that I would recommend and it's inevitable. You'll feel those emotions inevitably. But I think the most important thing is to just kind of find your little group and your people, people that you trust, people who are going through similar things.
Ava Reid:Having those friends and those connections was so essential for me and just like keeping my sanity during debut year and also it's not everything. I mean my debut was fine, it was, it did okay. I mean it wasn't like again, this big slaggy thing is studying. Drowning is my third book, so it's definite. And I have so many friends who are on you know their fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh books, and that was the one that popped off Becca Ross, who's been writing like I've loved her books forever. She's just been consistently putting out just amazing, amazing books and I feel like she's finally getting, you know, getting recognition for it, which is awesome, and this is her seventh book. So, yeah, just remember that it's not everything and it's not like your one chance and if you blow that, it's like your career is over. That's definitely definitely not true, even though that narrative is like very heavily pushed um.
J.D. Myall:But yeah, that's encouraging. Thank you, um. What message would you like to give? Um, just in general, like any closing thoughts for readers, for fans, for aspiring readers, for anybody um, I've always.
Ava Reid:I mean, I think all writing advice at this point is kind of a cliche um, which is fine, but I think my kind of favorite piece of writing advice, or the one that resonates with me the most, is just to write the story that only you can write and the one that feels the most real and true and honest to you, something that you're proud of, because this is a really really emotionally taxing experience, that it's a really tough industry and you're gonna have to fight really hard for your book and for your vision and you're gonna spend years and years working on this book. And you're going to have to fight really hard for your book and for your vision and you're going to spend years and years working on this book and you're going to have to again defend it to people and deal with criticism. So if it's not truly like a project from your heart, I think you're going to find that very difficult. And I think the difficult moments of publishing all the many, many times where it's just like I wanted to give up it was that idea of my book is something that was really important to me. That kind of kept me going.
Ava Reid:What are you working on now? What are you working on now? I actually just got my uh line edits for my next YA project, um, which is coming out in 2025 I believe in the winter of 2025, um, so I will be working on that exciting.
J.D. Myall:Where can people connect with you?
Ava Reid:So mostly on Instagram. It's just at Ava S Reid. I do have a TikTok. I'm really bad about using it. It's also at Ava S Reid. I'm trying to make a concerted effort in 2024 to post on that more regularly. But my main is instagram and I also have a terribly, terribly outdated author website, but that's also avasreadcom. Don't be like me if you're an author, update your author website regularly well.
J.D. Myall:you were a joy to talk to in interview and interview, and I wish you continued success. You don't need my little wishes, though You're already flying.
Ava Reid:No, I mean, I appreciate it. That's another thing about this industry is things can change very, very quickly. Perfect.
J.D. Myall:Thank you so much. I appreciate your time, I appreciate your patience.
Ava Reid:Of course, this is great. I hope you're feeling okay. You're a doctor's appointment.
J.D. Myall:I got hit by a car a lot that's awful.
Ava Reid:I hope you feel better soon, jesus it's like everything happens at once.
J.D. Myall:First I got like the book deal and I was excited because that's been a goal forever. So I was like, yes, a dream come true. They got hit by a car like literally.
Ava Reid:I'm so sorry for laughing, but that's like it.
J.D. Myall:like, what is fate doing?
Ava Reid:Oh yeah, Well, that's going to be a great story. You know, when you're doing interviews like this and people ask you like what was your like publishing experience like, and you're like, well, I got my book deal. Then I got hit by a car, but again, thank you so much and you have a wonderful day.
J.D. Myall:I appreciate you.
Ava Reid:Of course you too Feel better.
J.D. Myall:Thank, of course you too Feel better. Thank you Bye. Nice meeting you. I hope you enjoyed our chat with Ava Reid today. You can find Ava's books wherever books are sold. And now, for those of you who are curious, I figured I'd end episode three by giving you a little bit of background and history on myself and my publishing journey. Hope you enjoy. Okay, so my publishing journey. My publishing journey was kind of like a twisty turny one.
J.D. Myall:I always loved to read my entire life. I was the odd kid that would read a 300-page book a day. I loved really all kinds of books. One of my favorite books was Kindred by Octavia Butler. I used to read a lot of BC Andrews, stephen King, anne Rice when I was really young. I liked books like Will of Thunder. Hear my Cry. I was obsessed with the Outsider. At one point when I was young, I think I read that book like 32 times and I memorized the first page. When I stepped out into the bright sunlight, in the darkness of the movie house, I had only two things on my mind Paul Newman and a ride home. I could go on and on, but I just further embarrassed myself.
Speaker 1:so I was always a book nerd always loved writing.
J.D. Myall:Um novel was really bad but oddly, like the very first time I attempted to write a novel, a lot of the plot elements had were similar to the movie Soul Flute, which was really odd because I was super young at the time and I was just writing and being creative and I went to the movie and I saw it and I was like wow the time and I was just writing and being creative and I was the movie and I saw it and I was like wow, somebody did that already. They did it so much better than my little young attempt to do this.
J.D. Myall:Um, then I was an army brat, so I moved around a lot and, again, books were my best friend. I was raised as an only child, um, my brother wasn't born until years later and I have a sister, but we weren't raised in the same home. We have different mothers so I didn't meet her until way later. Um, so yeah, I was an army brat. I loved to read, I loved books. It was a little odd and quirky Still a little odd and a little quirky, and I just always read, always wrote.
J.D. Myall:I decided I wanted to attempt to do it professionally, pretty much after I got divorced. I was a single mom with kids, two of whom are autistic and on the spectrum, kids um, two of whom are autistic and on the spectrum, um, four kids, so four, four kids and was just really trying to process a lot of what I've been through and just trying to get back in touch with my creative side and my writing. I did photography and stuff too, so I was just really trying to reconnect with the parts of myself that I lost during that toxic and abusive relationship and got back into writing again, and I was, you know, pretty strong at poetry. My plots would fall apart in a longer narrative. Short stories and actual novels are very different.
J.D. Myall:I didn't know anything about writing craft, but I definitely had a lot of belief in myself, even though I didn't have the ability to back it up yet. So I sent it to the book I've written to be professionally edited. This time it's like, oh, I'm really taking this seriously. Now I'm gonna get an editor, I'm gonna do the things I think professional writers should do. And this editor was basically like um, she was a really good lady. She could have just took my money even though the project was nowhere near ready for that. But she was like sweetie, um, you need to learn story craft, you know, you need to get better at plotting. Um, you know, and she was right, I needed beta readers to look at it to help me identify the things that were working, the things that were not. It didn't make sense to pay. For example, it didn't make sense to pay for edits on parts of a novel that should be cut because they weren't serving the story. So you know. But she put me on to learning about craft and recommended some craft books and I absolutely adore and love craft from like Donald's Donald Moss's book, the Emotional Craft of Fictions, the breakout novelist and Bird by bird, and Stephen King's on writing. Pretty much, if it's a craft book and they make it, I probably read it multiple times and taught everyone who was open to hear about writing, craft and fiction writing, because it just it was a passion of mine. I wanted to improve every day and study every day and I do, and practice and practice and better myself at writing. And what that particular editor doesn't know is was I kind of had a little bit of a litmus test for myself.
J.D. Myall:My current novel, the one that I sold recently. It's currently called Hard Scam, but I don't know if the editors will change the title. If they do, I will update with the current title, but it's kind of like described. It's like Outlander meets the Night Circus. It's these magical black time-traveling families that have had this feud that's kind of been gone, ongoing, um, and basically the spell that gave them their power has also cursed them into this magical feud in the time travel. It just has really all these really cool elements of it and stuff. And what that editor doesn't know is because for my own little personal litmus test, when I was workshopping that story and I was sending it to my beta readers, I sent a couple chapters to that editor like anonymously totally different name just to see how she'd respond, and the response this time was like wow, this is really good, this is publishable. You know, you need to keep working on this and I was like my own little personal private victory.
J.D. Myall:And she had no idea it was me. She had no idea it was the same writer. She probably doesn't even remember, you know years ago, how she told me I wasn't ready and I needed to work on my craft. But for me that was a celebration moment, um so like I said I was writing.
J.D. Myall:Early on in my career, I wrote, like most professional writers, a couple bad books. We all have our books in the nightstand or on the hard drive. That didn't really go anywhere because we weren't ready yet. Writing is a journey. You need to constantly be practicing and learning craft and building your skills so when the moment comes, you're ready to meet it. But I did believe in myself. Like I said, I'm getting a little ahead of myself, I'm sorry. I'll get back to the origin story. So I um had sent that um, not so great novel to an editor, and you know her feedback was working in craft, and I worked on it a little, but I still wasn't there yet at that time. But I totally believed in myself, even though the belief in myself shouldn't have been there yet.
J.D. Myall:So you know, though, I was a single mom, though you know, money wasn't like awesome at the time, because I was just on the heels of a divorce. I wanted to support my dream and my desire to be a writer and my ambitions, so I got a publicist. I decided I was going to self-publish this book this terrible book after querying this terrible book unsuccessfully terrible book after querying this terrible book unsuccessfully. So I and again, this is not the book that I'm coming out with. This isn't the book that sold. This is earlier in my writing career.
J.D. Myall:So I queried this horrible book and naturally everyone said no, thank God. They said no because I really wouldn't want that to be that book, to be my introduction to the world, cause I think I'm way better than that now and I'd truly be embarrassed if that was how you met me. So I queried people. They were like no, no, thank you, no, no, no. So then after that I um decided well, I'll self-publish it, I'll do it myself. I got the interior, interior laid out, formatting, cover, designer, all this stuff, all of them. Most of the people who did these services for me were aspiring as well. So you know, some of the services looked like they were inspiring people to. But shout out to the entrepreneurship. You know that's a good spirit to have. We all have to start somewhere.
J.D. Myall:It's how we learn and how we grow. So from that point, um, I put this book in the universe. I hired a publicist and she represented me for a very brief time because my budget was very small. But she told me she's like you know, you can't really afford to keep paying a publicist for this, but if you keep, you know, working on your writing or your blog for different sites and stuff, they'll have to have your bio in the bottom and that'll help promote your work because you can link to your website and then that links to your books and stuff. So I was like awesome and that's what I did then I that was how I originally started with news, magazines and stuff like that. Originally I would pitch to blogs or magazines and those crickets. People weren't really overly interested in just me as a person.
J.D. Myall:I was a little nobody nobody, never heard of, but something I learned from Tamika Newhouse. For those of you who don't know, tamika Newhouse does the AAMBC Literary Awards in Atlanta and I volunteered there for years and would help her house. Um, for those of you don't know, tameka newhouse does the aambc literary awards in atlanta and I volunteered there for years and would help her out. Um ran her a writing staff for her earlier on, did everything from packing up the gift bags to eventually working my way up to being on her board. And one thing I learned from her was, you know, she always had her name in the conversation with bigger names, which is a great promotional tool. She does her awards every year and it highlights great authors, but in doing so, people also learn about her because she's, you know, the one putting on this event.
J.D. Myall:So then I thought, well, you know, maybe that's a good idea. So while I was there volunteering, I'd be interviewing the nominees and I'd be pitching these interviews to Writers Digest, migs Magazine and all these different publications. And it helped Tamika because it's getting publicity for her event. Interested in just hearing from me at that point in my career, or interested in hearing from people like Nikki Giovanni and hearing from these published writers with bigger names than mine. So that helped me get my earliest interviews and then, once I had a track record with Writers Digest and magazine and Huffington Post and other publications, then I could get interviews on my own. I didn't have to just, you know, rely on the attendees and the awards and stuff like that.
J.D. Myall:But doing that, like I said, and started putting the name out, started promoting that really terrible book that I'm now so ashamed of, that I try to buy every existing cabbage and I took it down. So those of you that are curious hopefully will never get your hands on one because it's embarrassing, but anyway, um. So, like I said, so then I that was in the universe and through interviewing you know, I made some of the connections that led me to get my book deal and my deal with my agent and stuff like that. But it wasn't an overnight path. You know, I went to Drexel and got my MFA, continued to study craft. I'm one of the co-chairs of the Drexel MFA Alumni Association. I've been a better beta reader and a sensitivity reader. I beta read for Kimberly Jones and Gilly Siegel's novel I'm Not Dying With you Tonight.
J.D. Myall:They thanked me in the credits which is very sweet and they're also, you know, in upcoming craft chats, so we'll be hearing from them, if you haven't already heard from them. Check out the episode.
J.D. Myall:Healy is in episode one and Kim is in the coming episode two not episode two, but an upcoming episode as well. I should say and I I forgot to mention in my earlier recording that I also did a lot of internships and mentorships, any way that I could learn more about writing, about publishing and, you know, try to network and make connections. So I was doing the Writers House Mentorship Program, writers House Literary Agency. I did their mentorship program briefly. I did the Tessera editorial mentorship. I did the Breakthrough Writers Boot Camp. Kate Brawning, an editor, gave me a scholarship for that program. She liked my work and I did that program as well. And all of these different programs, from Drexel's programming to these mentorships and internships, just helped enrich me and help me grow as a writer, along with reading books on craft and watching every video and thing I could see. And again, that's why I do craft chat, because I want to share the knowledge that helped me get where I am. And now I will continue with my story, thanks. I've been a judge for the Writers' Digest annual competition a couple of years in a row. So for a couple of years, years, I've done that.
J.D. Myall:Um, I just worked all kinds of jobs in the literary sphere now and my book is coming out. Um, one is coming out 2025, the Heart's Gambit book and again, that name might change. We'll find out. If it does, I'll let you know. And I have another book coming out in 2026 and so far the debut process has been exciting um, a lot of writing and vision. Um, we haven't really announced yet and I'm saying this and giving the deets on the book, um, on video now, because it'll already be announced by the time this video launches, but right now still secret, so you're sharing a secret with me. But, yeah, so that was how my journey began. Um, again, always loved craft. Once I discovered it, I fell madly in love with it and I just wanted to keep learning about writing and practicing writing and sharing the love of writing and literacy with others, which is what led me to doing the craft chats for Drexel. Like I said, I'm a co-chair of the Drexel MFA alumni and, as one of the presidents, of the.
J.D. Myall:Alumni Association. You know I wanted to share the love of craft with the alumni and current students at Drexel, which I do with the alumni and current students at Drexel, which I do. A lot of the interviews you'll see on here are interviews that are taped with Drexel students in the audience and then students and alumni and them asking all these questions. Some of them are just separate from separate author interviews. I do, but since most of my writing for Writers Digest and stuff centers around craft Writers Digest and stuff centers around craft I kind of wanted to have a hub of craft knowledge so that all of you can learn and benefit and enjoy the industry insights and the publishing professionals talking about publishing and crafting what's hot. Maybe it'll help you reach your journey and becoming a published author faster than me, because when I got started I didn't really clearly understand craft, I didn't clearly understand genres, I didn't clearly understand what was hot and you know that made my process take a little longer because you have to account for that learning curve. So hopefully Craft Chat Chronicles will help you guys get all that stuff learned so that you can reach your dream and reach the goal of becoming a published writer and perhaps even a best-selling novelist sooner. So that's why I started Craft Chat. That's who I am, and that was my writing journey.
J.D. Myall:Through the interviewing, I met Donnell Clayton, actually, and she owns K Creative and Electric Postcard. And as I was interviewing her and we were talking about her company, she was talking about she's hired, how she hires writers, and this, that third. So then I was just like, hey, in an interview, shoot my shot. So I did and I basically, you know, told her I write, and she was like oh.
J.D. Myall:I'm curious, so you know. I asked her if I could send her some. She said she was curious to read it. I sent it to her, her, she called me back. She's like I love it, I want to work with you and the next thing I know I'm signing to Susie Townsend at New Leaf Literary to represent the book and I'm off to the races. So you know it's an IP project. I will do another video at some point talking more in detail into how IP works and all that good stuff.
J.D. Myall:But, like I said, so that was how it all really connected and it all really started with that bad book. So I guess I can't hate the bad book, because had I not done that horrible book and tried to put it out in the universe, I never would have started doing other interviews. Put it out in the universe, I never would have started doing other interviews, I never would have had the interview with the person who, you know, started the wheels motion to getting my dreams of becoming a traditionally published author to come to life. And so I guess in that way, you know, every step is a needed step. Every part of our journey is an important part, but that's my story. Um, important part, but that's my story.
J.D. Myall:Um, like and subscribe if you enjoyed this. I appreciate you guys listening to craft chat chronicles. I also intend to have a lot of other 2025 debut authors who will be coming out around. The time is me on to talk to you about debut year and their experiences in your publishing journey and share some knowledge of craft that helped them get their book deals. So looking forward to sharing that with you and I hope you enjoy it. I hope you learn a lot from it. I'll chat with you again soon.
Speaker 1:Bye, JDMioco. That's JDMiocom. While you're there, join JD's mailing list for updates, giveaways and more.